Kangoo Timing Belt...

[KemppiFrog]

So realized that it was likely well over the km limit and set to. No book, but I did have one for a Scenic, also with the 1.5 dci. Looked at a video or two. Didn't look any different to the Scenic, which I had changed the belt on.. But, I had much less space than the Scenic, or the vids on the Kangoo, and it was a nightmare just getting the belt exposed. I had to make/adapt several spanners/sockets to get at things, as the normal ones just couldn't get in due to clearance.
Bruised and bloody knuckles later, the belt is on, with a new water pump and gen belt, will do the rest tomorrow. Glass of wine in hand at the mo..
Odd thing, the Scenic and the examples in the vid had the crank pulley held by friction, with a wacking 89 ft/lbs + 95 deg torque setting on the single use bolt, except this engine ( '07 ) had the pulley keyed (?), set the belt up and the pins for the cam and crank still indicated it was right. I assumed the keyless system was to lock the crank and cam, then tighten the belt with the crank pulley finding it's place before cranking up the torque.

Anybody with experience or thoughts on this?

KF

 

[Melvyn Best]

So realized that it was likely well over the km limit and set to. No book, but I did have one for a Scenic, also with the 1.5 dci. Looked at a video or two. Didn't look any different to the Scenic, which I had changed the belt on.. But, I had much less space than the Scenic, or the vids on the Kangoo, and it was a nightmare just getting the belt exposed. I had to make/adapt several spanners/sockets to get at things, as the normal ones just couldn't get in due to clearance.
Bruised and bloody knuckles later, the belt is on, with a new water pump and gen belt, will do the rest tomorrow. Glass of wine in hand at the mo..
Odd thing, the Scenic and the examples in the vid had the crank pulley held by friction, with a wacking 89 ft/lbs + 95 deg torque setting on the single use bolt, except this engine ( '07 ) had the pulley keyed (?), set the belt up and the pins for the cam and crank still indicated it was right. I assumed the keyless system was to lock the crank and cam, then tighten the belt with the crank pulley finding it's place before cranking up the torque.

Anybody with experience or thoughts on this?

KF

Possibly the cam sprockets are not keyed like a lot of modern engines? Done loads of the Scenics but no Kangoos

 

[Nomad]

Hope you get it sorted, I got a lot of good advice on RenaultForums when I was looking for help. Maybe ask on there?

Renault are currently top of my "No more cars even if they are free" list.
My Trafic van was a nightmare to work on (conrods won't come up through the cylinders).
The Espace has been stuck in the lockup for weeks (new headgasket & timing belt fitted, timing marks look ok but something isn't right - cam timing? - and the marks are out of sight when the engine is fitted in the car). Engine is tight against the body at the side, back, and top so no space to even change belts without collecting battle scars.

Nice when they're working

 

[KemppiFrog]

Had another thought.. The cam pulley has a spider, which I presume is keyed, and the pulley is bolted to that, so one would pin the spyder, while loosening the pulley while setting the belt up, then tighten it. As it happens, the crank and cam did line up when the belt was tensioned.
As for Renault in general. This Kangoo has done 380k km with virtually nothing done apart from services, even clutch is original, despite quite a lot of towing.
I had a couple of Espaces, but the fore and aft engine earlier ones. Working on them was quite easy. Had loads of others, as suitable for the places I lived, with less than perfect roads. 4s, 5s, a 12 break. Much more grief with the Ford I ran for a few years.

RenaultForums are good, I had a look, but nothing bounced up.

 

[Kj1123]

Hope you get it sorted, I got a lot of good advice on RenaultForums when I was looking for help. Maybe ask on there?

Renault are currently top of my "No more cars even if they are free" list.
My Trafic van was a nightmare to work on (conrods won't come up through the cylinders).
The Espace has been stuck in the lockup for weeks (new headgasket & timing belt fitted, timing marks look ok but something isn't right - cam timing? - and the marks are out of sight when the engine is fitted in the car). Engine is tight against the body at the side, back, and top so no space to even change belts without collecting battle scars.

Nice when they're working

Funny you say this I had a similar issue with a clio with the 1.4 petrol engine. That car nearly had me in tears so many times timed it up with all marks in position but when tensioner was released cam was always a fraction off. It was like that when I removed the covers before starting but put it down to be done wrong or belt stretch previously. In the end I believe I had to adjust the cam shalf sprocket ( make a new tool to do so ). It was better but couldn't get it spot on after around 10 attempts so had to just leave it be engine never ran as nice as it should have and I puy it down to timing being marginally off. That was just one of many battles with that car don't even get me started with anti roll bar bushings that u can't fit without longer bolts. After all that I promised myself no more renualts ever again.

 

[Melvyn Best]

Had another thought.. The cam pulley has a spider, which I presume is keyed, and the pulley is bolted to that, so one would pin the spyder, while loosening the pulley while setting the belt up, then tighten it. As it happens, the crank and cam did line up when the belt was tensioned.
As for Renault in general. This Kangoo has done 380k km with virtually nothing done apart from services, even clutch is original, despite quite a lot of towing.
I had a couple of Espaces, but the fore and aft engine earlier ones. Working on them was quite easy. Had loads of others, as suitable for the places I lived, with less than perfect roads. 4s, 5s, a 12 break. Much more grief with the Ford I ran for a few years.

RenaultForums are good, I had a look, but nothing bounced up.

Wouldn’t be the first time I’ve seen a sheared key inside a cam sprockets causing problems

 

[hollow]

This is from the 01 to 06 service book i have.

 

[DanZac]

This is from the 01 to 06 service book i have.

What service book is that from?

I've never seen a technical manual that says things like "or estimate the angle" or "115 degrees is a bit more than 1/4 of a turn".

All good common sense but seems a bit slapdash for an engine rebuild manual.

 

[hollow]

What service book is that from?

I've never seen a technical manual that says things like "or estimate the angle" or "115 degrees is a bit more than 1/4 of a turn".

All good common sense but seems a bit slapdash for an engine rebuild manual.

Its an unofficial peter russek pocket mechanic manual. Tis very home made looking but seemed good while i still had a kangoo.

 

[KemppiFrog]

Well, all back together and I started it (slightly resigned, if it all went bang bang) Usual instant start and quiet idle.
The Scenic book crank torque for the bolt just didn't work. I did the 89 lb/ft, then tried the 95 deg extra turn. Quite simply not possible. I had made a special extension for the Scenic, with a three foot bar to wind up. Went well with that engine.
Did about 30 deg, then no more. Not sure how much torque I was applyng, but serious.
Just hope all stays together..
Puzzled about two bolts left over, then remembered disconnecting the aircon (not functioned since I have had it..) and it was them.

The utube vids skipped how difficult the access is. Obviously, having worked out how to do it, next time will be a LOT shorter, just hope I don't have to do it...

KF

 

[GRW]

I have an 11-plate Renault Kangoo 1.5dci & an 08-plate Renault Master 2.5cdti.

While I have generally followed the mantra "buy French wine, French cheese, but not French cars" here I am.
Workplaces have run Kangoos, Trafics, run them hard and laden - and they've stood up very well without much tlc (the odd Trafic gearbox aside). The 1.5dci seems to have a solid reputation, and the Master mk2 one of the better large panel vans.

The cynic in me thinks that Renault know that Business & Fleet buyers won't tolerate unreliable, finicky vehicles - & that as a consequence the vans & light commercials are sturdier than their cars (I certainly hope so anyway!).

 

[KemppiFrog]

I have an 11-plate Renault Kangoo 1.5dci & an 08-plate Renault Master 2.5cdti.

While I have generally followed the mantra "buy French wine, French cheese, but not French cars" here I am.
Workplaces have run Kangoos, Trafics, run them hard and laden - and they've stood up very well without much tlc (the odd Trafic gearbox aside). The 1.5dci seems to have a solid reputation, and the Master mk2 one of the better large panel vans.

The cynic in me thinks that Renault know that Business & Fleet buyers won't tolerate unreliable, finicky vehicles - & that as a consequence the vans & light commercials are sturdier than their cars (I certainly hope so anyway!).

The engine is used in MB cars, among others
The general bad news is French electrics, the reason I binned the Scenic. but kept the donk, in case my kangoo one conked. It only has 120k km.
And, you can't object to a 2CV...

 

[GRW]

The engine is used in MB cars, among others
The general bad news is French electrics, the reason I binned the Scenic. but kept the donk, in case my kangoo one conked. It only has 120k km.
And, you can't object to a 2CV...

Nope - a 2CV or a Renault 4.... fantastic fit-for-purpose utilitarian tools. I'd happily trundle about in a Renault 4, enjoying simplicity, reliability and ease of myce & repair. Bliss!

I tell ya - the newish stuff - some of it appearing in work is worrying (almost as much as the EV).... 5-year-old, 40k miles small petrol cars (e.g. Volvo V40, 3-cyl, 1.5). Cyl head shot with a burnt valve. No aftermarket bits, no OEM parts..... buy a new head complete, at money that with the rest of the bits & labour runs at £6k, when the car isn't worth anything like that much.
It ain't progress!

 

[KemppiFrog]

Had 6 or 7 R4s and we have an '04 Twingo as the shopping trolley. Basicly the same engine as the R4, just with single point injection. As it is 30 yrs old, qualifies as a 'Collectable', so cheaper ins.

 

[Ace Paul]

French, no reason for it, just to pish you off.

There is a timing tool for Reno, not sure which one, where you have to read the instructions 20 times before opening the box as it’s A riddle.

There is a tit/nipple on the tool, fit tool so tit/nipple erected, Fit belt crank engine twice, recheck, nipple should no longer be errect.


Audi some of them if you don’t buy the £95 tool it WILL cost you 1500 beer tokens as it WILL go twang.

Ford fiesta wet belt 18 hours job, turbo off, tool is £800!

My vehicle, use the cam cover bolts to lock the engine.

 

[Kj1123]

Wouldn’t be the first time I’ve seen a sheared key inside a cam sprockets causing problems

Gone are the days where u could work on a car with simple tools. I believe the 90s was the golden age for motor vehicles manufacturers had mastered how to make reliable fuel efficient engines and were try to improve to be better than competitors. Seems since emissions regulations started to tighten up not only engines changed for the worse be manufacturers mind sets change we have now mastered the product let's start cutting costs where ever possible. Engines are now over complex gearboxes sealed for life, body work so thin u could shave with it and paint on vehicles very poor most suffer corrosion in no time . I genuinely worry where we will be in 10/15 years time will we just see cars as disposable after 10years and scrap and buy new can't see how that will be sustained and people will be in more debt trying to keep up.

 

[Nomad]

^ Agreed
I typed a reply that just kept growing, summary is mechanically the sweet spot for me was late 90s, maintenance clearly wasn't a design priority on some cars after that.
Electronically repairs on anything after the 80s gets very complicated. I had to open up BMW "sealed unit" rear lights and replace LEDs when they stopped working - component level electronic diagnostics & repairs needed when a £1 bulb from Halfrauds used to be the solution, the alternative was a new £180 light cluster from BMW and I needed 2