Hobbyweld

[Paul G]

I went to a car show last Sunday and there was a stand selling gas.
A 9L cylinder of 83/2/15 filled to 137 bar was £60 deposit + £40 for the gas.
On the plus side local stockist is near and handy and open 7 day a week.
Another plus is the 15%. A nice half way house plate thickness wise.

I use pub gas at the moment.

A good deal, or can this be bettered ?

Paul G

 

[hotrodder]

It all depends on how much of that flavour gas you're likely to go through per year...

In terms of gas volume that hobbyweld is (very roughly)* almost half what you'd get out of a BOC size X and getting on for 1/4 the volume in a BOC Y. Hobbyweld also do an 'ultra range' which are filled to 300bar with integrated regs and obviously priced very differently. There are other rent free suppliers that fill to 200bar for example Albee (AirLiquide) who offer a choice of 5 or 11 litre integra (reg included) cylinders, refill on an 11L Ar+15% CO2 is ~ £40 + VAT. All the info including fill volumes is on their respective websites with prices on stockists websites. The hobbyweld deposit is (mostly!) refundable, i believe the Albee start up fee is gone forever(?) while others like SGS gases completely refund the deposit but leave gas prices upto their stockists so they tend to vary a fair bit
The hobby deals (so no business names or bank accounts) BOC currently have soon make renting cheaper if you actually use the gas but AFAIK you'd have to live with argoshield light (Ar, 5% CO2, 2%O2) in a size Y unless you can negotiate something yourself on an argoshield universal

* BOC size X argoshield universal = 2.51 cubic metres vs hobbyweld 15 @ 137bar = 1.4 cubic metres. A BOC size Y is ~ 4.7 - 5.02m^3 for pure argon through to argoshield universal

 

[Paul G]

Thanks for the info Hotrodder.

I use two "pub" bottles a year costing £24 each. Local now has a new landlord and he has upped the price from £14.
Since he wants cash I can't claim this against tax, hence looking at rent free mixes.

Most of my welding uses argon, (TIG) and I have an account with BOC and rent a "W" cylinder, use two or three a year.
I therefore can't get a non-rent bottle for the MIG, Volkszone or whatever.

The Hobbyweld Ultra is £195 dep and £75 gas, so almost treble the price of a 9L. A reg is cheap enough so I don't see the
point of integrated regs.

I live out in the villages so would only want a supply with a local stockist. My nearest town (Sudbury, 7 miles) has a stockist
for SGS so will give them a ring. Don't fancy a three hour round trip just to change a bottle.

Cheers
Paul G

 

[Richard.]

It makes sense to keep it local Paul. My gas is done through AP which I can literally walk to and pick up the bottle. It might not be the cheapest (£70 a year,£75 refill all inclusive) for a 30ltr Ar but for convenience and saves messing around/ petrol costs etc it's the best I can do. 137 bar is only half filled so it's not really that cheap but it depends on how much you use as to whether it's a saving or not. (No point spending an arm and a leg on yearly rental if you only use one bottle a year) I use 3 a year roughly so my gas usage costs me £300 a year for 90 ltrs total each filled to 230bar. It's best to work it out per year to see what the savings are as different deals can appear to be cheaper but over a year they are not.
15% active is good for reasonably thick plate I'd say 6mm -10mm ideal and much above that then 20-25% is even better.

 

[hotrodder]

Gotcha. Dunno what size pub CO2 cylinders are but they're gonna last longer than a similar size cylinder of an argon mix, according to the internet a small cylinder with 9l water volume/6kg contents weight yields 3.2m^3

A hobbyweld ultra contains 4.3 x the volume of gas as their regular 137bar cylinders. According to Wellyweld the admin charge when you return it is the same £20 making the gas itself a chunk cheaper for the ultra cylinders.
Include the whole deposit as it's money tied up while you have the cylinder and assume 1 ultra cylinder/year (VAT inclusive prices from Wellyweld site)...
end of year one and the 137bar hobbyweld = 4.3 x 37.38 + 72 = £232.73 making it cheaper than the ultra @ 234 + 75 = £309
after two years it's the other way round £393.47 vs £384 for the ultra which after 3 years has become ~£100 cheaper

 

[pedrobedro]

I live out in the villages so would only want a supply with a local stockist. My nearest town (Sudbury, 7 miles) has a stockist
for SGS so will give them a ring. Don't fancy a three hour round trip just to change a bottle.

Cheers
Paul G

I bought SGS a while back from the local car spares shop. 10 litre 5% co2/argon filled to over 200psi (showing on the regulator) for £147 including deposit and gas. Probably last me 2 years at my present rate.

 

[Richard.]

I bought SGS a while back from the local car spares shop. 10 litre 5% co2/argon filled to over 200psi (showing on the regulator) for £147 including deposit and gas. Probably last me 2 years at my present rate.

with low usage like that
This is the case when going none rental is a lot cheaper. My rental alone over 2 years costs as much as that before any gas is included.

 

[pondy]

Thanks for the info Hotrodder.

I use two "pub" bottles a year costing £24 each. Local now has a new landlord and he has upped the price from £14.
Since he wants cash I can't claim this against tax, hence looking at rent free mixes.

Most of my welding uses argon, (TIG) and I have an account with BOC and rent a "W" cylinder, use two or three a year.
I therefore can't get a non-rent bottle for the MIG, Volkszone or whatever.

The Hobbyweld Ultra is £195 dep and £75 gas, so almost treble the price of a 9L. A reg is cheap enough so I don't see the
point of integrated regs.

I live out in the villages so would only want a supply with a local stockist. My nearest town (Sudbury, 7 miles) has a stockist
for SGS so will give them a ring. Don't fancy a three hour round trip just to change a bottle.

Cheers
Paul G

Please let us know if you come up with anything local Paul. I use pub bottles about 2 a year, with boc I will end I will end up paying rental for a bottle that will last me years but hobby weld is low pressure so I will get though a couple of them. Motor spares do hobby weld and the closest boc is gas and gear in thetford. I'm in a village between bury and haverhill

 

[rikrobson]

Since you havean account with BOC have you asked them for a price?

 

[Paul G]

^^^ No I haven't yet. ^^^


I've got a price from Motor Parts Direct, a local factor that deals with SGS. Depots in Sudbury & Braintree.

20L filled to 200bar £93 dep, + £73 gas
30L filled to 200bar £120 dep, + £84 gas

A bit more than I wish to pay bearing in mind the amount of use it would get.

Cheers
Paul G

 

[Paul G]

Just back from Motor Parts Direct with cheque book in hand.
"O, we don't stock it. We can have a bottle by Monday lunchtime if our main depot has it in stock."

Grrr Double Grrr

The search continues……...

 

[pedrobedro]

I went in the shed today looking for a spanner and noticed that the cylinder I have is 20 litre not 10 litre as I thought it was. I checked the receipt and it cost £147.95 for the deposit and gas. I got mixed up as I priced for a 10 litre originally.

 

[Richard.]

I went in the shed today looking for a spanner and noticed that the cylinder I have is 20 litre not 10 litre as I thought it was. I checked the receipt and it cost £147.95 for the deposit and gas. I got mixed up as I priced for a 10 litre originally.

That's really good for a rent free cylinder. I've seen them half that size for more money.

 

[daleyd]

I went in the shed today looking for a spanner and noticed that the cylinder I have is 20 litre not 10 litre as I thought it was. I checked the receipt and it cost £147.95 for the deposit and gas. I got mixed up as I priced for a 10 litre originally.

That's about the same as I got, I've also got a pure argon but that was a bit more for the gas.

Got it from the quality factor in chester (deva industrial estate). They had pure argon and co2 mix in stock (about 12 months ago when I bought them at least..) also got 20 quid cashback from SGS for each bottle which helped a bit. The amount I use rent free makes sense to me, and SGS seemed to be about the best in terms of price, taking into account availability and how local they were etc.

 

[Paul G]

Well off to the Hobbyweld stockist I went this morning, yes I know it's Sunday, and I could hardly get in the door for cylinders.
Now that's what I call a stockist.

Came out with a 9L cylinder of 15% and a sweetener 5kg roll of 0.8 wire for a fiver that's marked up as £25.99
My Lincoln takes 15kg rolls so I'll put it somewhere to gather dust.
I have the option, and probably will, to upgrade to the 300bar cylinder and just pay the additional amount.

Had a little test run and the results look good. Compared with the CO2 it's down with the volts and up the wire speed.
I'll soon find my pet settings.

Yes, I know it's not the cheapest, but it's near and handy seven days a week.

Cheers,
Paul G

 

[Paul G]

If your machine takes 15kg reels it should easily handle a 5kg - might "need" to make a spacer, but still. (I say "need" because half the time on a 15kg reel it's coming from the same plane as a 5kg one would, so I see no real issue...)

No No, what I mean is that 15kg reels last soooo long that by the time it runs out the 5kg will be covered in dust.
Mind you, when tight fisted customers expect work done for nothing it doesn't hurt to have a price ticket or two visible.

Paul G