gasless mig or stick

[robin osborne]

hello, I have an inverter welder running of a geney. I have done welding in the past and could make an ok looking weld. I am using gasless wire as in Portugal the price you have to pay each year just to use a gas company before even buying gas is ridicules, then on top of that another €100+ for gages as there bottles are different. anyway my question is. with gasless I carnet see the weld pool or what is going on my welds have penetration and hold but arnt the best looking. can you see what's going on with stick welding or does this have the same problem. cheers rob

 

[mike 109444]

Hi Robin Never used the gasless wire but have seen on forum that some recommend removing the shroud for better visibility as it's not needed for gasless.
Have you looked into using just CO2 which the pubs and bars must use for there beer and they would need to regulate it down as well so must have regs. Note there is a mix of CO2 and ?? that bars also use but that is no go for welding. Make sure you get just CO2

 

[robin osborne]

cheers Mike will try that today. will also ask about gas at local bar cheers

 

[Spark plug]

As long as what your welding isn't too thin stick will trump gasless mig any day IMO

 

[Kent]

Depends what your welding Stick is way better on thicker stuff, MIG on thin. I have only tried gasless once on some longish runs on 2.5mm plate corner to corner, it was pants so I swapped and did it with stick. If you cant see the weld pool I cannot see how you can have good welds, you can only be guessing .
The only thing I might add is MIG is easier to produce a respectable looking bead (note I am not saying strong sound weld) in all positions and it takes time to become proficient at this with stick

 

[norlander]

get a GYS gasless kit for your gun/torch-makes life much easier, there a picture of it in this thread I posted some time back.
Also, are you moving you head about to view whats going on? I know that sounds as though I'm being a bit arrogant or taking the P, but I'm learning (trying to learn) TIG, and for some stuff, the torch angle is boss and you have to get your bonce in position to see whats going on, so I have carried that lesson over into MIG and its helps.
I do a dry run sometimes to make sure I can keep the angle and see where I am going and what I am doing.
My welding plant* produces acceptable (for me) results with fluxcore wire.
Sparkplug is right, MIG with decent gas is ace, and thanks to a bloke who posts on here (brokenbiker), I have welded stuff outside, but there will be a limit to what you can get away with.
I am not too bad with MMA * after a warm up so I tend to use that for thick stuff outside, but, unless you are pretty, no, very good, you are having a laugh if you try carbody type work with MMA.
I have stick welded "sheet" (depends what you class as sheet) but I was 15 and an apprentice and had not been introduced to loose drink and strong wimmin-and no-I did not get that Rs about face.

Here is the thread http://www.mig-welding.co.uk/forum/threads/gasless-14-years-on.47118/
* I am on a crusade against yankyism terminology in British welding terms.

 

[robin osborne]

cheers for all your help. have made a shroud for gun so tip pokes out and viz is better. I am poking my head around like a chicken trying to get best view but still struggle to see what is going on throw all the smoke. I am getting nice ish looking welds tending to be a little on the hige side thouge. thanks again

 

[Richard.]

I agree with Kent entirely on this one mig and stick are two totally individual processes and to ask which is best is like asking the best between a knife and a fork.
Both are best at what they do.
Thick section on site with optimum strength it's got to be MMA
Thinner section lower skilled process and speed MIG all the way
There are other advantages to either process but that's a quick sum up. I don't like gasless mig either id shell out the extra £££ for a mix gas and make a job of it.

 

[Jan]

Sorry about the long delay in this response. The added gas that some pubs use is nitrogen. As this is what you are trying to eliminate by using CO2 or argon, then it's the last thing you need] in a shielding gas! Apparently it produces a better and longer head to a pint.

 

[Richard.]

Sorry about the long delay in this response. The added gas that some pubs use is nitrogen. As this is what you are trying to eliminate by using CO2 or argon, then it's the last thing you need] in a shielding gas! Apparently it produces a better and longer head to a pint.

It probably adds more bubbles in the weld too

 

[Kent]

I think I will stick to proper beers then

 

[Richard.]

I think I will stick to proper beers then

Nothing wrong with more and better head.