Fuel Oil Deliveries; Metering???

[MoreWellie]

Big problems for them if they get caught delivering less

As a lad I used to count the sacks the coalman delivered at home. One time I told my mum they only brought in 19 and a ton should have been 20
Lots of conversation about are you sure but I stuck to my guns
Parents complained and the depot manager sent the guys back with bags and scales and they had to rebag it all
and we got our final bag delivered with an apology at the end of it all

 

[addjunkie]

It was certainly heating oil that was going short as head office only opened an investigation after some commercial customers complained that their set deliveries weren't lasting as long as usual. Police involvement was only avoided due to head office not wanting it all over the papers, and in the absence of solid proof it would have been hard to get a guilty verdict.

Does this firm have branches in Hexham and Carlisle too by anychance. As I herd recently of someone being pushed over such things.

The meter on the delivery lorry should be certified / calibrated whatever the correct term is as its a fiscal meter ie the point of sale. This is also the meter used for any fuel duty.

 

[bricol]

As a lad I used to count the sacks the coalman delivered at home. One time I told my mum they only brought in 19 and a ton should have been 20
Lots of conversation about are you sure but I stuck to my guns
Parents complained and the depot manager sent the guys back with bags and scales and they had to rebag it all
and we got our final bag delivered with an apology at the end of it all

Someone I know father in law spent a weekend with a bucket and bathroom scales weighing the "tonne" bag of sand he'd had delivered . . . I can't remember if he returned the excess he found he had . . .

 

[More Amps]

Does this firm have branches in Hexham and Carlisle too by anychance. As I herd recently of someone being pushed over such things.

The meter on the delivery lorry should be certified / calibrated whatever the correct term is as its a fiscal meter ie the point of sale. This is also the meter used for any fuel duty.

You have pm

 

[Justme]

If you have a fleet of vehicles, it's quite easy to notice any vehicles with higher than normal fuel usage.
You might not think 5L of fuel per tank is noticeable, but even on something with a 100Litre tank, that's 5% extra of max volume, but if they're doing that every half tank, it's 10% extra, which is a noticeable hit on fuel economy figures.

You would think so but my experience is the driver makes a huge difference to the MPG.

I do some temping driving work for a local dairy, the lorries have efficiency meters.

Their other drivers get 4-6mpg most being around the 5mpg mark.
Yet the same truck on same route when I drive gets 7mpg.
So I could easily remove 8.5 gallons a DAY on a 150 mile day & no one would notice.
Ad in that the same truck gets driven by 2 people per day & by 3-5 people per week & it would be impossible to track.

 

[Justme]

ps just had a delivery of red.

It has a printout of current & end meter & the total delivered.

 

[hotponyshoes]

You would think so but my experience is the driver makes a huge difference to the MPG.

I do some temping driving work for a local dairy, the lorries have efficiency meters.

Their other drivers get 4-6mpg most being around the 5mpg mark.
Yet the same truck on same route when I drive gets 7mpg.
So I could easily remove 8.5 gallons a DAY on a 150 mile day & no one would notice.
Ad in that the same truck gets driven by 2 people per day & by 3-5 people per week & it would be impossible to track.

I expect thats just a result of all the other drivers nicking 8.5 gallons a day rather than your careful driving

 

[fizzy]

Most of the fuel lorries have a preset meter. The driver keys in how many litres you want and it auto shuts off. Useful when they are perhaps 20 yards from the lorry when filling the tank.

 

[Ross365]

Further to Monday's delivery, I've just been looking at the printout for the previous (February) delivery. It's printed with Qty Ordered (500L) and the price per litre and the total price. But handwritten is the qty delivered which was 512L. The price was for 500L

I know they debit your card at the time you phone the order in with the nominal quantity. I've never had them come back and ask for more. When he delivered this week he did not connect on to the standpipe with the auto-cut off, but he filled by taking the lid off the inspection port and seemed to be controlling it by hand and said he got the level to the "max level" tag. I'd said to them that I thought it would take 1000L, but if it could take more, then to fill it. I'm more curious about it than worried as my dip-stick is correlating well. As averaged out with deliveries over 3 years, the tank seems to hold 26.0 (+-0.5) L per inch height (but not corrected for temperature ).

 

[fizzy]

How much is it per litre now?

 

[More Amps]

Just curious, and I'm not familiar with the intricacies of fuel metering systems, but what is to stop a driver turning up for a 1,000 litre delivery, putting 900 litres into the tank and then pumping the extra 100 litres back into the tanker. The meter would show 1,000 litres delivered and the driver could unload his 100 litre bonus at his leisure...

 

[Ross365]

How much is it per litre now?

Including VAT 98.x p/L where I cannot remember x

 

[bricol]

Just curious, and I'm not familiar with the intricacies of fuel metering systems, but what is to stop a driver turning up for a 1,000 litre delivery, putting 900 litres into the tank and then pumping the extra 100 litres back into the tanker. The meter would show 1,000 litres delivered and the driver could unload his 100 litre bonus at his leisure...

In the case of petrol stations - anyone being sensible, and you would hope all of them with the volumes delivered at a time, you take a reading of tank contents before and after delivery - all figures entered, the difference should agree with drivers delivery figures, both of you sign, away you go.

 

[hotponyshoes]

Just curious, and I'm not familiar with the intricacies of fuel metering systems, but what is to stop a driver turning up for a 1,000 litre delivery, putting 900 litres into the tank and then pumping the extra 100 litres back into the tanker. The meter would show 1,000 litres delivered and the driver could unload his 100 litre bonus at his leisure...

Nothing apart from morals and the fear of being caught I suppose.
The tanker meter would show 1100l delivered but you could bypass that by putting 900l into the customers tank and 100l into drums that you hide in a layby for collection when you knock off.
They could certainly get away with it at my place as I am rarely there when they deliver but the driver won't know what sort of capability I have to check the delivered amount. I would guess there is the possibility of a test trap as well, maybe like when vosa send dodgy cars in for mot checks.. they might be waiting to check it as soon as he's left?

Mate of mine drives heating oil deliveries.
I do get cheap oil from him now and again but it always involves giving him a hand after hours to remove or replace a customers tank. The "old" stuff is sent my way.
These are always side line jobs but I presume he picks them up when doing the deliveries. The company policy is not to transfer oil from an old tank into the new one and I have witnessed him suggesting to the customers that they transfer the oil across themselves but they don't want to get dirty hands..

To be fair, anybody with a bit of nonce that could transfer the oil themselves would probably not have to pay a couple of lads to lift a plastic tank onto blocks and take a steel one to the scrapyard for them so I'm happy enough to help out in exchange for a few drums...

 

[The Artilleryman]

Back in the days when I was a TA gunner, I was the Adj's signaller (1 of 4). We were coming to the end of the weekend exercise and LR's needed fuel. We had a main CP (command Post) and a step up - for moving forward without loosing comms. As I was off stag, took the step up CP to the fuel point and took the spare jerry cans for main CP - idea being at End Ex we could get away quickly and be home before 2200 (Monday start of 0450 driving a LT bus - drivers hours, what drivers hours).
JNCO in charge of fuel pumps wouldn't let me fill the jerry cans on main CP's work ticket, he demanded to know who the Adj was, as he was going to report him (and me), when I told him, he very quickly helped me to fill the jerry cans.
On getting back to the CP, Adj. asked "Any problems" with a grin on his face. If I remember correctly we were at Catterick that excercise, or was that the one where I at long last managed to get CP step up LR condemned (series LR with no compression, been like it for a year).

And if I wanted a full days pay Friday of an exercise weekend, i would be driving back and fore to Woolwich Barracks to fill up all the vehicles - soul destroying, but I needed the extra money - mortgage rate going up every month, well into double figures.

Only reason I kept my flat was thanks to all the extra days I did with the TA.

 

[Justme]

I expect thats just a result of all the other drivers nicking 8.5 gallons a day rather than your careful driving

Coupled with the driving stats (mostly based on braking efficiency using retarder & anticipation) they get of 48-55% compared to mine of 80-95% I think not.

 

[Trevorleach]

You would think so but my experience is the driver makes a huge difference to the MPG.

I do some temping driving work for a local dairy, the lorries have efficiency meters.

Their other drivers get 4-6mpg most being around the 5mpg mark.
Yet the same truck on same route when I drive gets 7mpg.
So I could easily remove 8.5 gallons a DAY on a 150 mile day & no one would notice.
Ad in that the same truck gets driven by 2 people per day & by 3-5 people per week & it would be impossible to track.

And that is exactly how the smart driver would do it knowing full well that when he went on holiday the rest would carry on with the crap economy without even trying.

 

[James1979]

i know the depot engineering manager for the local bus depot. (It’s a national company) I was chatting to him yesterday about this and he reckoned that other than actually catching someone in the act they would have no idea.

Their buses are full of telemetry. Also any one of approx 30 drivers can drive any bus and on a given day it’s normally a half dozen minimum in and out of a bus.

There is a watered down version of the telemetry on the dash - some of the drivers make it their mission to keep the red light on as long as possible during the shift. Some don’t care and it’s not their bus or fuel. Others do try to keep the light green (good economy / driving).

They get individual stats via an app on their phones in real time. There is a WhatsApp group where they unofficially compete to get the lowest scores.

There is no way on earth the company have any control over diesel usage other than at point of filling.