Filarc E7016 '56S' Vs. Buzzbox.

[SiPMerlin150]

Before i get shot, i really like these rods, an ebay seller is selling in bundles of 36 for £7.00 or 'make an offer'

They say minimum voltage is 65 volts...my unit is 50 volts.....question is...will those rods miss the extra 15 volts? Or am i just being daft? I love these rods, i ideally would get an inverter, but i'm just tinkering around between courses to keeping up my 'aim' with the stick.......

 

[PTvor]

I think you'll find they are a waste of time with that machine.

http://www.mig-welding.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=32842

 

[Drains]

Those 15 volts will make all the difference unfortunately. I've seen good 7018s thrown in the bin in disgust at them being bad rods when it should have been the buzz box getting binned.

Always a winner to come along afterwards with a decent set and say "look, nothing wrong with them!" You don't mention the extra volts of course. It's all technique, honestly.

 

[SiPMerlin150]

Those 15 volts will make all the difference unfortunately. I've seen good 7018s thrown in the bin in disgust at them being bad rods when it should have been the buzz box getting binned.

Always a winner to come along afterwards with a decent set and say "look, nothing wrong with them!" You don't mention the extra volts of course. It's all technique, honestly.

the box of rods state min. 65 volts. Why on earth are buzz boxes still around?

 

[PTvor]

Because they're cheap, fairly small, more or less run off a 13A plug, put up with being left in the damp and all sorts of treatment inverters wouldn't take, and they will burn 6013s, which is all that most peope wanting to do a bit of welding to fix the garden gate or put together a couple of custom brackets, are interested in.

It's amazing how much useful stuff you can do by burning no more than a couple of 6013s, which would cost a fortune to get someone to do, or be very messy with bolts and things.

 

[SiPMerlin150]

Because they're cheap, fairly small, more or less run off a 13A plug, put up with being left in the damp and all sorts of treatment inverters wouldn't take, and they will burn 6013s, which is all that most peope wanting to do a bit of welding to fix the garden gate or put together a couple of custom brackets, are interested in.

It's amazing how much useful stuff you can do by burning no more than a couple of 6013s, which would cost a fortune to get someone to do, or be very messy with bolts and things.

I guess they are cheap enough to pick up when you are considering learning the basics of the process before delving in, but 6013's are pretty much a general purpose and good for learning/easy to store. I don't even touch mine anymore, its duty cycle is so pathetic, its not even worth the time to unravel the extension chord

 

[Rrunnach]

Can't remember last time I used my MIG set, I still use my trusty SIP 140 amp buzzbox. bought box late eighties, still going strong, just like me

 

[PTvor]

Horrible things to learn with and you certainly couldn't build a battleship with one, even allowing for the duty cycle.

However, considering the market they are aimed at, being able to hit and miss metal glue a few bits of angle iron together solves a lot of problems in the shed or in the garden. It's amazing the strength even rubbish welds have in terms of holding up a line of washing.

I suspect most buzz boxes are either bought on impulse and not used, or are bought for a specific job which is sort of done well enough and saves some money.

Oil cooled welders imply dedication and inverters are not an impulse purchase sort of price for many.

Anyway, I doubt you'll find much else apart from 6013s you can burn on that machine.

 

[Rrunnach]

Horrible things to learn with and you certainly couldn't build a battleship with one, even allowing for the duty cycle.

I don't know really, I bear in mind, I was welding for a living prior to buzzbox purchase, get the setup right, one can produce good quality welds, with peelers as a bonus.

I suspect most buzz boxes are either bought on impulse and not used, or are bought for a specific job which is sort of done well enough and saves some money.

Reflecting: last time I used my mig, this was along with buzzbox, I bought an Avon Searider RHIB, commercial spec, was an oil platform safety rescue RHIB, heavy duty hull, no trailer, which I got delivered to SeaDog @ Leith Docks.

I basically knocked up a Snipe breakback braked trailor, using both plant, MIG thermal cutout kicked in, use MMA, and vise-versa till complete. Trailer got galved.

I towed a heavy boat, with diving gear inside, all over Scotland, bumpy single track roads, in and out salt water, for four year, no problems at all with weld integrity.

Point I'm making is, although single phase kit, they can, and do, produce very good quality work, BTW, 6013 used.

Cheers.

 

[PTvor]

Yes, but that was your skill, I'll guess learned with an oil cooled welder.

Now imagine someone trying welding for the first time with a buzz box and a couple of nice clean pieces of 6mm plate trying to lay down stringers until they get it right, then trying a pad. Burning three rods then waiting ten minutes and then another couple and waiting another ten minutes and like that.

A bit frustrating.

Back to SIPMerlin150's problem. Are there any 7016s easily available in the UK and likely to run on a buzzbox with 50V OCV?

 

[Rrunnach]

Yes, but that was your skill, I'll guess learned with an oil cooled welder.

Now imagine someone trying welding for the first time with a buzz box and a couple of nice clean pieces of 6mm plate trying to lay down stringers until they get it right, then trying a pad. Burning three rods then waiting ten minutes and then another couple and waiting another ten minutes and like that.

A bit frustrating.

Back to SIPMerlin150's problem. Are there any 7016s easily available in the UK and likely to run on a buzzbox with 50V OCV?

I was not disputing from a learner point of view, buzzbox are best kit to hone welding skills.

My point was, they are capable of producing decent work, within their capabilities, albeit a poor duty cycle at upper range.

Don't know any brand names that manu 7016 that fire up under 80 OCV?

 

[TechnicAl]

I was not disputing from a learner point of view, buzzbox are best kit to hone welding skills.

My point was, they are capable of producing decent work, within their capabilities, albeit a poor duty cycle at upper range.

Don't know any brand names that manu 7016 that fire up under 80 OCV?

There is Oerlikon Spezial which is quoted as 65V min OCV but I think Ive seen them run on a 50 OCV set........but my memory isnt what it was.

There are some 7018s that will run on low OCV sets.

 

[Rrunnach]

There you go then, you learn something new every day. < 80 OVC!

OP may well get away with purchasing rods mentioned in first post, be wiser to speak with friendly weld supplier for perhaps a sample or three for trial purposes?

Cheers.

 

[SiPMerlin150]

There you go then, you learn something new every day. < 80 OVC!

OP may well get away with purchasing rods mentioned in first post, be wiser to speak with friendly weld supplier for perhaps a sample or three for trial purposes?

Cheers.

Sadly, theres no 'known' welding supplies near me that are happy to sell rods in less that 300+ quantities.. a lot of the places are large industrial sets that wont even allow you near the vicinity of welding (perhaps health & safety along with security against metal theft) , they dont reply to emails or letters

 

[PTvor]

Elga P47D? The data sheet says 55V OCV and that it works with small transformer welders.


http://www.rapidwelding.com/dynamic/DisplayItem.aspx?c=P47D32&zl=4

I haven't tried them and couldn't say. £40 and postage is a lot to fork out for something you may not be able to use.

Why not do as the website says and ask Andy? Cheek him for a sample.

 

[SiPMerlin150]

well, i've taken the plunge and knocked the seller down to £5.60 easily for 36 of the filarc's but unfortunately he charges £5.00 for postage ! you win some lose some. Still, its better than buying a full box and being sad that they aren't working on my set.

If these rods don't work, i'll keep them stored and burn them up on one of the cebora's in the welding academy .

The fella that was selling the elga rods on ebqy hasn't bothered to get back to me on buying 10 or 12 elga 7016's. Ah well, his loss!


When they arrive, i'll dry them a little and burn a few (or try to!) and post up images.

 

[SiPMerlin150]

Update 7016-1 with low ocv

Rods arrived today and burned a few and they ran absolutely fine! Ran them slightly hotter than recommended on package, but they turned out fine.

Excuse the crud around the welds, i have no wire brush as the bristles fall out of mine very quickly!

 

[rich r]

Yay! And a trip to Poundland for another wire brush

 

[SiPMerlin150]

Yay! And a trip to Poundland for another wire brush

yeah...see how long those last!

 

[SiPMerlin150]

Ground down open root pass...see any inclusions?

Ground off an open root pass done with a 6013 just because i've not bothered to do so before an was interested to see how it was..