False ceiling joists

[printcom]

I am looking for ideas, I want to put an insulated ceiling up in a barn. The span is 4.5 meters. I have always used something like 9x2" for a span like that but the price of timber is making me squeak. Does anyone have any experience of metal studding or any other ideas ?

 

[Burdekin]

Is there room to put in a rafter/truss instead? You could put in pretty shallow 2" x 4" Howe trusses to span that distance instead. http://www.locketruss.com/roofspan.pdf

 

[Pete.]

What about jumbo studwork? Should easily hold up a ceiling over that span though they usually come up to 4.2m long

 

[KaneH]

You’ll be more expensive for metal stud work than timber. I assume it’s a portal frame shed? If so, suspend a lighter weight timber frame off the underside of the purlins / rafters then sheet that.

 

[gaz1]

so use this reference instead unless you intend to store above the ceiling

https://www.mig-welding.co.uk/forum/threads/new-lean-to.73677/

 

[printcom]

Sorry chaps, I should have attached this on the OP,
Height to ridge is 4.4 meters max, width 4.3m ish (sandstone wall not as straight as it could be) Length 14.8 meters. Ceiling height required 3 meters approx. I am considering putting a stud wall inside the sandstone wall to straighten things up (it leans out)
At 600 centres I am going to need 27 joists and the best I have been quoted is £18+vat for a 4.8meter length. I cant help feel thats a bit overkill for a non load bearing ceiling support.

 

[gaz1]

is that your shed or not ?

as some idiot didnt put strengtheners on those beams you can tell as theyve twisted and seperated

you need 7 load bearers 2 at the wall edges either end

then swap down to 3x2s as only supporting insulation and plasterboards

 

[gaz1]

ive drawn them in for you

red marks is extra beem support black are how its supposed to be

choose your method as one wall bit is higher than the other its either come lower or take it higher to match the original truses

either way its going to be work that needs doing



you can get 4x2s or 5x2s full length 4.5m

you either put more beams in or you use 3x2s for full length

so your choice now

 

[eLuSiVeMiTe]

There is a lot of storage up there. If you frame the walls and span with decent timbers you've gained a decent loft

 

[printcom]

is that your shed or not ?

Yes it is mine, its been standing for around 100 years . The right hand wall is 400mm+ wide sandstone wall that has been reinforced with buttresses and the left wall was rebuilt this year.
But I can see your point.

 

[gaz1]

There is a lot of storage up there. If you frame the walls and span with decent timbers you've gained a decent loft

but then he goes down the girders reference not wood

hes got 2 storage areas to use if he wants to do or just use one of them insulate the other

his choice though

 

[eLuSiVeMiTe]

but then he goes down the girders reference not wood

hes got 2 storage areas to use if he wants to do or just use one of them insulate the other

his choice though

Girders?
Why. Can span that with timber no bother

 

[gaz1]

4.5m wood is expensive cheaper to use girders and lighter

if he intends to store up there

 

[Domdom]

Well, there is usually quite a bit of 6x2 in 4.8m lengths on facebook marketplace, I’ve been looking at some myself for 6 quid each if you collect. He doesn’t do delivery.
https://www.facebook.com/marketplace/item/578414699588649/

something else I did when building the house extension (very old house so crap materials, not square etc) was to reinforce some joists which were 4x2 and should have been 6x2 with flat steel bar. There was way too much bounce in the upstairs floors and the inspector wanted all the joists changing which would have meant much destruction of the front walls to get the new ones in, plus the aggro of even lower ceilings downstairs.

I bought some flat 70mm by 5mm lengths of steel, drilled them with a mag drill and sandwiched the original beams between 2 pieces with a M12 bolt and 50mm square plate washer every 450mm. The steel was cheaper than buying new joists at 6x2. Definitely no bounce in the floors now and the inspector was happy with it. Maybe something similar with some of those 6x2 might work for you?

 

[addjunkie]

What your going to use the building for will dictate what you can and cant do, if you just want an insulated roof, of a shed workshop, just frame out the roof and use king span, if you want it for accomodation, youll need to frame it all out.

If you just want a ceiling with rockwool above, why not use say 8x2 acroos the way, then frame out the other way with lighter timber to carry your plaster board and rockwool.

And yes timber is expensive Ive just settled the bill for all this in the pictures, these are going to be holiday accomodation.

 

[addjunkie]

According to the span tables you would need 9x2 for a mid level floor in C16, so just to support a ceiling you could use far less.