Employment law

[Olderisbetter]

A friend was sacked a while back for gross misconduct which he disagrees with, after him appealing there has been an investigation run by his employer in which they had very little evidence of which some was incorrect but upheld the sacking, when he took the job he was told he could not be in a union but it turns out this was not true, so he does not have any union back but was a long term member of the union prior to taking this new position with the same employer, his finances restrict getting legal help, any ideas or information from anyone that's been in a similar position?

 

[m_c]

Citizens Advise, or find a local employment lawyer for a chat to see if it's worth pursuing.

 

[iNf]

ACAS 03001231100 is free and impartial advice. Lots of lawyers give half hour free consultation, try and find an employment law specialist one.

 

[Rannsachair]

To make an unfair dismissal claim, it needs to be submitted within 3 months of termination, also you need at least 2 years in service.

Even if he meets the above, there is a lower burden of proof for the employer than in a criminal case: the employer must meet 'on the balance of probabilities' rather than 'beyond reasonable doubt.'

 

[MattF]

his finances restrict getting legal help,

Worth checking his home insurance. Sometimes that includes legal cover for employment issues, I believe.

 

[angellonewolf]

ACAS 03001231100 is free and impartial advice. Lots of lawyers give half hour free consultation, try and find an employment law specialist one.

2nd this

but i believe the 2 years bit is right as well under 2 years they just have to have a reasonable reason why for it to be upheld

 

[premmington]

As from 2013 it has become free to take an employer to an employment tribunal. There was fees up to this point - but they been declared unlawful by a Judge (rightly so in my opinion).

You do not have pay your ex employers legal fees if you loose (they also do not have to pay your costs even if you win).

If you are on a budget - and feel you have been unfairly dismissed - and think you can prove it. Your options are ACAS (long slow soft job) - or take your employer to a tribunal yourself.

But and this is big but... It maybe a allot of personal stress and levels of compensation rewarded are only about as equal to what you would get if you were made redundant (so you are going to need to have long service to make it worth while). Money vs the stress involved.

Higher payouts need to be based on gender/religion/race. Your right to join a Union - may have a higher value than the payout for unfair dismissal....

A close of female friend of my missus - had a run in with a "toxic employer". She walked and fought hard and won a constructive dismissal case (employer felt the effervescent scorn of a middle aged woman). But even at directors level/high salary - the payout was just not worth the legal costs or time/stress involved.

My advice always is: Walk away - lick your wounds clean - get another job - move on - life is too short for all of this - it is only a job mate (you can get another)...

 

[BrokenBiker]

ACAS 03001231100 is free and impartial advice. Lots of lawyers give half hour free consultation, try and find an employment law specialist one.

'if' they get back to you...I tried them when I was leaving sparrows and they tried charging me for training costs that were never agreed to...I had been at RWC for 6 weeks before they ever acknowledged the case. Fortunately I have a way with words and got it dropped before I actually needed legal assistance

 

[premmington]

'if' they get back to you...I tried them when I was leaving sparrows and they tried charging me for training costs that were never agreed to...I had been at RWC for 6 weeks before they ever acknowledged the case. Fortunately I have a way with words and got it dropped before I actually needed legal assistance

@BrokenBiker - I think ACAS is good if you are en mass and loads of employees over an industry or a service provider have a big dispute - Doctors/Train Drivers/Bin men.

But if you on your own - you are just gonna be - well "on your own"....

 

[BrokenBiker]

@BrokenBiker - I think ACAS is good if you are en mass and loads of employees over an industry or a service provider have a big dispute - Doctors/Train Drivers/Bin men.

But if you on your own - you are just gonna be - well "on your own"....

Yeah when they got back to me they didn't seem massively I retested, as if there want enough in it for them.

Happily though, not only did I prove my point but I also paved the way for others that have since left after similar undocumented training

 

[jo1010]

AND....try to find a no win no fee deal. Not applicable in a few legal areas where compensation is low, but it removes the risk of being taken for a ride by a solicitor who charges by the hour/letter.....

 

[Kayos]

I had an issue, I won't go into details of who or what

I went through the company appeals process, to be told on the day of the meeting the appeal only covered the conduct of the person who did the original process and not the process itself, I found this incredibly unfair and turned out it was in fact not anywhere in the docs.

The appeal was predictably refused, based on that narrow view point

I was prepared to go to tribunal, got everything ready and then decided I did not need a year of mental stress so I withdrew

Life, work, employers can all be ****, it caused me huge issues but taught me a lot

It is now very much in the past, moving on was the best thing I did

 

[Mick Annick]

I had an issue, I won't go into details of who or what

I went through the company appeals process, to be told on the day of the meeting the appeal only covered the conduct of the person who did the original process and not the process itself, I found this incredibly unfair and turned out it was in fact not anywhere in the docs.

The appeal was predictably refused, based on that narrow view point

I was prepared to go to tribunal, got everything ready and then decided I did not need a year of mental stress so I withdrew

Life, work, employers can all be ****, it caused me huge issues but taught me a lot

It is now very much in the past, moving on was the best thing I did

This… I went to tribunal, paid for a good expensive solicitor, company settled at 5.00pm the day before we were due in court, but it wasn’t worth the stress nor the money won. Best advice is find another job and move on with your life.

 

[8ob]

but it wasn’t worth the stress nor the money won. Best advice is find another job and move on with your life.

I have heard that said so many times. Better to negotiate a deal whereby you have resigned rather than been given the tintack and move on, dismissals look bad on a CV.

Bob

 

[Agroshield]

...was a long term member of the union prior to taking this new position...

Contact the union. For the cost of a phone cal, at worst, they will say they cannot help. Slightly better, they might advise on who could help.

 

[Kayos]

I have heard that said so many times. Better to negotiate a deal whereby you have resigned rather than been given the tintack and move on, dismissals look bad on a CV.

Bob

But do they?

Any large company will only give start and end date plus job title for a reference. Any more needs to come from a friendly manager

I get emails from former team members even years later as the official reference just confirms they worked there

 

[addjunkie]

But do they?

Any large company will only give start and end date plus job title for a reference. Any more needs to come from a friendly manager

I get emails from former team members even years later as the official reference just confirms they worked there

Id agree with this on paper. But might be different in an unrecorded phone call, especially as some industries are a “small world”

 

[Kayos]

Id agree with this on paper. But might be different in an unrecorded phone call, especially as some industries are a “small world”

I get this, my industry is practically incestuous it is so close.....

But again, the bigger players love to hide behind HR and Corporate, try speaking to HR or Legal as an outsider at some of these firms will get you nowhere and references are box ticking these days

 

[angellonewolf]

I think when I spoke to my old boss I was chatting saying no employer can give a bad reference he said yes thats true but its the way you word it that gives the point across
Also he said you can also refuse to give a reference when they ask

 

[mark roberts]

The investigation should of been done prior to the sacking. Then there should be a disciplinary meeting. You cannot be sacked like that, it would automatically be unfair dismissal. You also cannot be prevented from joining a union. A workplace must be over 50% to become unionised.