CNC router machine

[DAPPH]

No, that would require 4 or 5 axis. You are look at 3 axis (possibly with a 4th but let’s not confuse things).
So imagine a 3d part that is cut top down, you can’t have undercuts etc.
3d parts are generally made on routers by rastering the cut I.e. scanning back and forth cutting a small slice of profile every time.

Got ya ..... Thanks .. it's a whole new language for me .

 

[WorkshopChris]

Alphacam also produce a combined Cad Cam http://www.alphacam.com/alphacam-router
They configure the post processor to suit each machine interface.
I think they now do various on line licencing options.

I like that idea of a tool changer it would be advantageous indeed. It's not for a business nor for massive large numbers as commercial use as such, but will be used to teach people how to design , programme & or operate the machine .

The tool changer opens so many options for example all in one program.

16mm for rough cutting and bulk waste removal.
5mm for reducing corners and holes for pins.
12mm for cam holes.
8mm for dowels.

You can then take components off and assemble with just a little end grain drilling. Most of the commercial offerings will also include a multi spindle end grain drilling heads.

 

[DAPPH]

Here is some info to give an idea of what 2D is able to produce
http://help.autodesk.com/view/INVHSM/2018/ENU/?guid=GUID-A999FD6B-3A09-46CC-82F9-FA9D959852F3&v=2019
And 3D
http://help.autodesk.com/view/INVHSM/2018/ENU/?guid=GUID-16189902-F8F4-4854-BEE6-46E49F5671E0

As Matt says if wanting to get fancy you really need 4,or 5 axes.

Thanks Hood ,
I think 3D will be what we are looking for ..it's seems a poor investment to get a simple 2D flat cutting machine when we can perhaps for a tad more do contoured 3D carvings like a fleur de lyon either down into or as standing up above the rest of a billet of material ( think I said that right )

 

[Hood]

Most machines will be capable of full 3D it is more the CADCAM that can be geared more to 2D.

 

[Hood]

What type of things are you planning on making?

 

[DAPPH]

Alphacam also produce a combined Cad Cam http://www.alphacam.com/alphacam-router
They configure the post processor to suit each machine interface.
I think they now do various on line licencing options.


The tool changer opens so many options for example all in one program.

16mm for rough cutting and bulk waste removal.
5mm for reducing corners and holes for pins.
12mm for cam holes.
8mm for dowels.

You can then take components off and assemble with just a little end grain drilling. Most of the commercial offerings will also include a multi spindle end grain drilling heads.

Can you do dovetail joints on these machines with the wood/ material laid flat if you programme them correctly ? I can visualise half joints no problems and but not dovetails nor simple finger joints .

One project we were looking at was thinking of using it to make strong oak boxes 30 x 24 x 24 inches high in 1" thick oak with rounded corners , recessed floor & a curved pirates chest type lid .

 

[DAPPH]

What type of things are you planning on making?

Anything from simple boxes to jigsaws to puzzles to small furniture in wood , in metals some 3 D milling of brass in 30 mm thick square bar. some name plates , in aluminium flat 2 d cut plated to make various brackets when TIG welded up .( It's a different part of our intentions to get younger people into basic engineering skills ) In plastics ......… perhaps signs , some in decoupage ( sp? ) where you build up the letters in ever smaller replicas till you have three or four stacked on top of each other . In plywood routed into specific forms as strips rounded or square solid bodies . Toys are another area several folk are interested in exploring & building .

 

[Hood]

Traditional dovetails wouldn't be easy to do, yes you could likely 3D mill them but that would take time and getting a sharp inside corner wouldn't really be possible.

 

[Hood]

Anything from simple boxes to jigsaws to puzzles to small furniture in wood , in metals some 3 D milling of brass in 30 mm thick square bar. some name plates , in aluminium flat 2 d cut plated to make various brackets when TIG welded up .( It's a different part of our intentions to get younger people into basic engineering skills ) In plastics ......… perhaps signs , some in decoupage ( sp? ) where you build up the letters in ever smaller replicas till you have three or four stacked on top of each other . In plywood routed into specific forms as strips rounded or square solid bodies . Toys are another area several folk are interested in exploring & building .

You would definitely be looking at 3D CADCAM for a lot of these.

 

[DAPPH]

OK thanks so ….. how's about some rounded dovetails , like some drawers have , they look like proper dovetails on the outside edges the round inners are hidden inside the joint to a large extent .

 

[Hood]

Not really sure what you are meaning but going back to a traditional dovetail, if you had enough Z Axis travel to stand the part up or had a removable section in the table so you could drop the part vertically then you could do them with a standard dovetail cutter.

 

[WorkshopChris]

Can you do dovetail joints on these machines with the wood/ material laid flat if you programme them correctly ? I can visualise half joints no problems and but not dovetails nor simple finger joints .

One project we were looking at was thinking of using it to make strong oak boxes 30 x 24 x 24 inches high in 1" thick oak with rounded corners , recessed floor & a curved pirates chest type lid .

Dovetails you would really be looking at a 5 axis machine.
But you can produce very accurate miter joints easily.
It's a different mindset to traditional woodworking.

Oak 1" would really need a different table on the machine, solid wood is normally held with vacuum pods and clamps. and ply mdf veneered chip would be worked on a flat table held with a vacuum. The oak would need to be thicknessed first do you have the facilities.

 

[DAPPH]

Traditional dovetails wouldn't be easy to do, yes you could likely 3D mill them but that would take time and getting a sharp inside corner wouldn't really be possible.

So there is no vertical vice clamp device under a lift out panel in the middle of the bed where you could insert say eight thicknesses of planed wood in the vertical and route the dovetails out all in one go on that end of the wood / plastic ( a bit like setting up wood in a simple dovetail jig for hand held routing .

 

[WorkshopChris]

You can build all sorts of holding jigs, but basically, think of your material as held down flat on a horizontal table via vacuum.

 

[DAPPH]

Dovetails you would really be looking at a 5 axis machine.
But you can produce very accurate miter joints easily.
It's a different mindset to traditional woodworking.

Oak 1" would really need a different table on the machine, solid wood is normally held with vacuum pods and clamps. and ply mdf veneered chip would be worked on a flat table held with a vacuum. The oak would need to be thicknessed first do you have the facilities.

Yep we have two planer thicknessers , one a semi industrial Record bench mounted machine , the other is an Italian industrial jobby about 400 mm wide with a 170 mm max throat with cast iron beds & a four inch vacuum take off .
One thing we thought of was if we wanted to make a decent sized dining or coffee table top we should be able to make it trom

strip of say 6 inch wide planed & thicknesed wood ( Birds eye maple tickles my fancy currently ) biscuit joint them cramp them over noght using bridges /bows to get them as flat as possible .Then ​

mill it perfectly flat to thickness on both sides … it would certainly beat having to get a big rubber vacuum bag & a large 10 tonne steel flat pressing machine & start hand finishing it with a plane or power plane ..

 

[WorkshopChris]

That would be possible but the tooling may be pricey solid wood is less suited to basic cnc tooling, you would need to think about grain direction and the tool paths. We would often set a machine running over a lunchtime to resurface sacrificial jigs on 10x4 sheets of 25mm mdf.

 

[DAPPH]

You can build all sorts of holding jigs, but basically, think of your material as held down flat on a horizontal table via vacuum.

The demo I saw had a couple of dozen adjustable height stepped blocks that bolted into " T" slots on the bed to clamp the materials down . It didn't escape my attention that the guy had gouged several of the aluminium clams . Same with bed damage where he's not tried to do slow passes with the cutter raised up the thickness of a sacrificial sheet of hardboard fitted & clamped over all the bed with the emergency button in his hand to stop the machine if a strike on the test board looked likely .

I saw a perforated thick rubber sheet which I guessed had been used at some time to try and stop bed strikes as well as several well marked perforated peg board backing boards where he'd cut a mm or so right through his main material when making wooden lacy looking doilies .

 

[DAPPH]

That would be possible but the tooling may be pricey solid wood is less suited to basic cnc tooling, you would need to think about grain direction and the tool paths. We would often set a machine running over a lunchtime to resurface sacrificial jigs on 10x4 sheets of 25mm mdf.

Had a piece of fairly recently naturally seasoned three year old 2 inch thick local harvested green pine … ******** if I could get the thing smooth in any of the planers ......it's grain was like an Abyssinian guinea pig's fur .....no two fibres ran in the same direction . I guess a CNC router bed will have similar problems some times .

 

[DAPPH]

OK, my bed is calling me , I'll catch up with you lads later on

Dave .

 

[WorkshopChris]

On regular jobs, we would keep the base jig sheet in a rack ready for the next time job was run.
You often need to leave small tabs on parts that are raised a 1mm off of cutting right through to keep parts located then just trim at the end.