Clarke 105TEN - wire speed on 0.9mm zintec

[jb2000]

Shiny new Clarke 105TEN, GASLESS wire; 0.9mm zintec; auto-helmet, FFP3 3M mask.

Power = 1 & Min, Speed = 5-6, shroud just knocking on the metal.
Bacon crackle, reasonable bead shape, but penetration is a thin line rather than a symmetrical reverse penetration like #3 on the tutorial.

Speed 3 allows me to slow things down, get more symmetrical penetration at expense of a noticeably wider weld.

Instructions say speed control 5-6, tutorial says about 2.3 metres/sec, is it time to get the stop watch out? Anyone tried this model & thickness?

 

[octo0072000]

settings

just ignore the settings start on min and go from there it's harder to get it right with gasless though on thin metal it's just practice and you will get there


have a look at this youtube video lots more on there
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vbmyc0QQlZ8&feature=related

 

[jb2000]

Start on min...

Power to 1+Min as before.
- Speed to 2... arc basically goes out.
- Speed to 3... arc holds... weld bead bulge top AND BOTTOM... fine bacon sizzle.

I am coming from years of precision soldering, so my lateral motion is very slow - dropping speed down compensates for that.

Looks like I will be ordering lots of non-zinc coated 0.9mm steel for practice... get the bead ok... then tack weld ok... then butt weld ok... then plug weld ok... welding takes a long time to learn.

 

[octo0072000]

practice keep at it

to be honest welding with gas-less makes it a lot harder to learn lots of splatter and messy welds seems to be the norm
will that mig of yours swap over to gas or not even if you use Co2 it's a lot better than gas-less i can't get on with gas-less i just make a mess and blow holes on thin stuff not bad on 2mm or 3 mm though but that's me


is yours a 105EN Mig see handbook link

http://www.clarkeservice.co.uk/manuals/mig_welders/mig90en_151en.pdf

 

[philsmin]

on my 90EN I use setting 1/max, and that's for welding 20's gauge steel gasless, if i'm welding thinner 22's gauge I have to use a pulsing technique otherwise I just burn holes in it, if I use 1/min I don't get enough penetration.

Wire feed is set around 4.5

 

[jb2000]

The 105 will do Gas, but the job (wheel arch rammed) will require No-Gas re outside.

Interesting settings, will try them when the weather has dried, I saw a video on the internet of an older guy doing a chassis in short bursts & compressor cooling the welds - absolutely superb work approaching TIG in neatness.

Here is what 1+Min & speed 3 look like, top & bottom in same image...

Not very neat, there is penetration, they are done slow (slow enough to have control). Apologies for the images, just changing my camera so that is a £2.24 cheapy.

 

[octo0072000]

welds

you can still weld outside with gas
i have done for years just make a wind shield couple of sheets of cheap OSB board or MDF 8x4ft cut to 4x4fit 2 hinges on worked for me either leave wood colored or paint Matt black or dark color you don't want reflections from the mig those welds are ok for gas-less
cheapest way for gas is C02 talk to pub landlord of find a beer gas place if you buy a co2 reg you can get a converter if you go over to argon and vice versa



pub gas Cheshire any good for you

http://www.beertrading.co.uk/

 

[jb2000]

I did think about a screen (would need one anyway re welding in the driveway). Noted re CO2 cylinder supplier (good for practice at least, then use proper CO2/Argon for the car with 0.6mm wire). Gasless is a bit like a Tandy 50W soldering iron with nail for a bit used for surface mount soldering.

So those welds are ok for Gasless?

 

[octo0072000]

from what i have seen they are better than a lot of others i have seen
see if you can butt weld a couple of bits of 1mm or 0.8mm and again it's another story when it comes to doing it on a car thin metal technique is the way to go

if you are blowing through try starting off on 2mm gives you time to perfect your technique for a c02 reg to convert yours see
weldquip link

http://www.weldequip.com/co2-conversion-kit.htm

have fun

 

[jb2000]

> from what i have seen they are better than a lot of others
> see if you can butt weld a couple of bits of 1mm or 0.8mm and again it's
> another story when it comes to doing it on a car thin metal technique is
> the way to go

Noted, I will do more practice on the beads, at least they are not like rice-crispies! Noted re weldequip, bookmarked.

Then it will be trying to butt weld a load of 0.9mm non-Zintec, then plug weld. Butt welding will be interesting re controlling warpage.

I need to butt-weld 6-inch of inner wheel arch, then butt-weld 14-inch of outer wheel arch with some plug welds. To get competent I think I will need to weld a few hundred feet :-) You really do need a "wheel barrow load".

 

[octo0072000]

that's why i said go down the co2 gas route gassless wire will cost a lot more than getting a bottle and a reg

 

[jb2000]

I am just nearing the end of my first gasline mini-reel, with a free unopened second.

I believe Argo/CO2 disposable run out at 10-15L/min (if you can get them to 15L/min) in about 6-7mins, but CO2 disposable at 10-15L/min run out at 30-50min or so. With 0.6mm wire and a good wind shield that might work. Adams do CO2 for £19, argo/co2 for £31.19, plus refundable deposit, plus delivery and I would need a regulator on top. A lot cheaper than disposable, but I do not have much welding to do (busy looking after a relative, running a web business and someone knocks the car off the road!).

The problem with wind is the SW prevailing wind, plus road angle, plus driveway are all smack in line. So when there is no wind, there is still "some wind". There are thus very few times when I would get even a "very light breeze or near windless". Welding 6"+12" of wheel arch is all I need to do. The inner wheel arch is 6", the outer is 12".

Got a load more 0.9-1.0mm steel on the way to practice tack welds with stop-start bead fill-in with gasless. The stop-start needs to be <0.5sec due to the insulating slag on top, and the tacks need a brush likewise. I can lay a perfect neat bead on 0.7mm & 0.9mm now with gasless, much better than before, but butt-weld will need stitch practice w/ Clarke 105TEN.

 

[octo0072000]

i was meaning the pub gas type stuff or go see landlord of local pub see if he can get one for you i use a bought 2 bottles a year and find all sorts of things to mend or make as retired on medical grounds if i did not try to do a bit i would go off my trolly just sat in a chair i spend most of my time on forums mind is willing body is not kind of thing all the best with your welding
have fun if you was anywhere near me i could have lent you a bottle and reg im up in south Yorkshire

 

[jb2000]

Thanks, will try more with the gasless and may well try a disposable CO2 gas even if I do not try it for the job so I am ready in the future (once done the welder will be sold, but I am using it to develop basic skills for the future).

Think every pub round here has been demolished and turned into apartments... or wine bars... bizarre world. Just wait till the water supply turns sour... :-)

 

[shenion]

You will get better results if you clean the zinc coating off with a flap disc or grinder. Makes the weld much less stable and the fumes can cause "welders fume fever". Not nice to have.

Then again, the smoke from the gasless is not much better.

 

[jb2000]

Gasless fumes are truly obnoxious, zinc heavy metal poisoning (zinc flu) is not to be taken lightly at all and is accumulative. A mask is essential, 3M FFP3D masks with a rubber gasket surround do seal the face properly.

Did some 0.9mm work Gasless today and it was actually good.

Then I believe I hit the inherent limits of Gasless :-)

I tried tack welding a butt-joint of 0.9mm & 0.8mm car steel. One tack weld was ok, but the other made the 0.8mm shrink like oxy against solder! It must be very very difficult doing 0.7mm car steel with gasless if you can not get a copper heatsink behind it.

So...
Took my £18 ebay voucher and applied it to 3 disposable 110L argo-co2 cylinders (£35) and borrowing a colleagues disposable gas reg (that he never used it tells a tale!). Picked up some 0.6mm wire & tips.

For comparison Adams gas is £43 inc vat & delivery for 9L 130-bar argo-co2, equivalent to 13 110L disposable. That translates into £43 v £152 which is enough of a saving after just ONE refill to have bought a WELDER(!). Weldequip do a decent regulator kit for £46 delivered, spanner from somewhere is £4.

Q - How much of a wind shield do you need, for an intermitten breeze you can just feel on your face (not moving your hair)?

Q - I think the ground is quite critical, my croc clip actually only grips poorly on one edge - probably 1mm*1mm. At low volts resistance matters more, is it worth clamping to a copper sheet or drilling & fixing a copper "tongue" to the clamp? The clarke clamp is a bit of a naff clothes peg in that respect.

 

[octo0072000]

earth clamp

if the earth clamp is not up to much loads on fley bay
a good earth does make a big difference

here you are a fiver delivered

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/WELDING-EARTH...046?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item415ac70e76

 

[jb2000]

That is much better, I looked last week for a better clamp and oddly just found a magnet type. Might have been friday morning with ebay maintenance.

Dragging the EN105 clamp along zintec coated steel I see a 0.2mm hairline scratch... AA battery has better than that :-)

 

[jb2000]

Weather & lack of earth clamp prevented any practice, but squeezed in a few mins today.

Clarke 105TEN + 0.78mm uncoated steel + 0.9mm Clarke Gasless wire.

Front...

Rear...

That is my first attempt at "doing a proper auto thin sheet weld".
I did not 3M clean-n-strip the surface of the metal so still a bit of oil on it.
The BSW on there are my over-welding without cleaning off the slag.

Getting there, not quite overlapping beads which is quite hard re gasless.

I have ordered some Lincoln Innershield NR-211-MP 0.76mm which is a whole lot thinner than Clarke 0.9mm gasless. Will be interesting to see if that is any better. The clarke is relatively low splatter, but yes gasless is hot.

 

[philsmin]

I find thinner wire is easier, i've bought a roll of .09mm clarke stuff and it's not as good as the 0.8 stuff I had from toolstation