Boc price rise

[Omniata]

Is it the same size bottle filled to the same pressure - i.e. is it cheaper per litre of gas?

As long as I use more than one Y every 2 years or so BOC still work out the cheapest option that I can find (longer than 2 years with some suppliers as they're further away).

Smaller hobby cylinder filled to 200bar.
I'm paying £20 a month for two W's at the minute, one Ar, one O2...
A refill is/was £65 for me on Ar, £18 on O2.

It's £45 deposit, £34 fill for a 10ltr cylinder and no rental or minimum requirements of volume of usage in a given period from the local new firm.

The two W's are about half full, maybe a bit more, and I've been paying rental for over 6 years on them.

I appreciate the money I've wasted, I'd hope people won't start telling me what I already know. I've not had a great time over the last 6 years or so, I'm trying to move on, one of the reasons for coming back here, it's something I enjoy, want to improve at, and maybe want to make an attempt of a career in, if that's at all possible now.

Saving £250 a year in rental is a saving after all.

 

[PhillipM]

unless your useing lots dont deal with BOC i hear from people working at the local BOC depot that cylinders are still coming back much faster than they are leaving, as all the light users are going elsewhere but maybe thats what they want

The rental kills it for people like me that only use a couple of refills per year on 3 bottles.
Especially when my local indy firm does a refill for 35-60 quid (10 litre argoshield light vs large argon for the latter) rental is £10 per year (yes, year), and they will pick up and deliver for free...

 

[Omniata]

@Omniata - with that level of usage it's probably the right choice for you to ditch it.

With my usage on those figures, it'd be more expensive

There's no such thing as one overriding best deal for everyone imo - there's so many variables that it's not possible to say anything other than buying toy bottles from halfords is bad...

The frustrating thing is my usage at the time was high enough to make the big cylinders cost effective when the delivery charges were lower too, now it's over £50 it's a nightmare.
I've got barely 2 beans to rub together at the minute and can hardly afford to lose the money on the gas shoving them in the back of a car, but can barely afford the rental either.
If and when usage goes up again I won't be returning to BOC that's for sure, I'll charge for work based on the price of the gas and having no rental and no delivery it's far more cost effective.

Edit: A 10ltr cylinder at 200bar would work out between 3 and 5 hours welding time I think? Operating 10l/min at 10psi, as I said, I think, it's 02:00 again and my brain is thinking of switching bodies with a slug...

 

[Hood]

Below is what I was getting charged from Air Products, was constantly going up and was getting a bit annoyed to say the least. Rental is also expensive, think about £20 a month.
I now get my Argon from *removed for legal reasons* and it certainly works out cheaper for me. I get 30L at 300bar for £245 of which £120 I get back when I return the bottle, return delivery is £13.

The gas in the bottle is just under 9m³ and I think the Air Products is just under 12m³ So if you take 3/4 of the £195 for AP's Argon it works out at £146.50 so I saved on gas and in addition I save £240 a year on rental.
Have heard of another supplier in Glasgow area and if what I hear is right (and they deliver to my area) then I will be going with them.

 

[Omniata]

Below is what I was getting charged from Air Products, was constantly going up and was getting a bit annoyed to say the least. Rental is also expensive, think about £20 a month.
I now get my Argon from *removed for legal reasons* and it certainly works out cheaper for me. I get 30L at 300bar for £245 of which £120 I get back when I return the bottle, return delivery is £13.

The gas in the bottle is just under 9m³ and I think the Air Products is just under 12m³ So if you take 3/4 of the £195 for AP's Argon it works out at £146.50 so I saved on gas and in addition I save £240 a year on rental.
Have heard of another supplier in Glasgow area and if what I hear is right (and they deliver to my area) then I will be going with them.




View attachment 96744

Another one for the notebook, good for all sizes of user and allows upscaling and downscaling
Although prices are +VAT, worth noting...

 

[Hood]

The only thing you have to watch is you lose your deposit in increments over time. For the 30L one I get I think it is 6 months for 1/2 deposit and a year for full. That is not a problem for me as I go through a bottle a lot quicker than that even on quiet spells so get the full deposit back.
For the smaller bottles I think I read it was 1 year and you lost half then 2years for full but you would have to check out their terms to be sure.

 

[Hood]

Here it is

 

[Stueeee]

interesting that there are 300 bar filled cylinders available, not sure my oldish regulators would like that much input pressure.

The Adams gas "trade" cylinders that I have now are pretty much the same size as the BOC (size Y?) ones I had before.

Here's a photo of them all together before the BOC ones went back.


Adams gas are 200 bar fill, BOC were/are 230 bar IIRC. Adams gas fills do work out slightly more expensive than BOC, but even so, my "back of a fag packet" costing seemed to indicate I had to use 8+ cylinders a year before the rental option would work out cheaper.

Has anyone here used the rental free oxy acetylene setup available from Air Liquide? It'd be nice if I could dump the BOC cylinder rental completely, I'm not a big user of OA, but "when you need it, you need it".

 

[Stueeee]

@pdg, Hmm, the "hobby" Adams Gas cylinders certainly didn't look to be good value for anyone but a very occasional user when I checked their pricing -but they didn't need anything too onerous in the way of documentation before agreeing to provide the trade jobs to me. The 200 bar cylinders have much better per litre pricing.

Re. the other stuff, my cylinders come from an agent who delivers free (fairly) locally, that's handy for me living in Kent, but I wouldn't have thought that this arrangement was unique countrywide.

 

[Hood]

Just went to return a bottle to *removed for legal reasons* and it has gone up from £13 to £24 for the return of an empty. Thought that was a hell of a hike so decided to see what, if any price increase was on the bottles I normally get. 30L 300 Bar Argon is still the same as before £59.99 for the gas but Deposit has gone from £120 to £130 and delivery has gone from £45 to £100.
So last bottle basically cost me £139.80 which is the cost of gas, delivery and return as I get the deposit back.
If I ordered another it would be £216.
Now I can see £ being low being a factor, can see oil/fuel price increase being a factor but no way it will amount to a 55% increase.
Looks like I will be going elsewhere, even BOC or Air Products are cheaper than that
Local place I get my welding stuff from is away to start SGS bottles so will have to look into that.

 

[normspanners]

Argoshield Universal (size W 11.71m3) – £11.78. Monthly Rental £7.65/cyl.
Pureshield Argon (size W – 11.01m3) - £11.24. Monthly Rental £7.65/cyl
Oxygen (size W – 11.09m3) - £6.25. Monthly Rental £7.65/cyl
Dissolved Acetylene (size H – 8.63m3) - £51.69. Monthly Rental £8.45/cyl.
Stainshield Universal (size L) - £46.72. Monthly Rental £7.65/cyl
Transaction Charge - £35.00/delivery or £9.25 collect charge from BOC outlet.

are you sure those are correct ?
I priced argo light fill the other day and it was £100, oxy £90 ish and acet was £150+ from an indi

 

[ukracer]

Just went to return a bottle to *removed for legal reasons* and it has gone up from £13 to £24 for the return of an empty. Thought that was a hell of a hike so decided to see what, if any price increase was on the bottles I normally get. 30L 300 Bar Argon is still the same as before £59.99 for the gas but Deposit has gone from £120 to £130 and delivery has gone from £45 to £100.
So last bottle basically cost me £139.80 which is the cost of gas, delivery and return as I get the deposit back.
If I ordered another it would be £216.
Now I can see £ being low being a factor, can see oil/fuel price increase being a factor but no way it will amount to a 55% increase.
Looks like I will be going elsewhere, even BOC or Air Products are cheaper than that
Local place I get my welding stuff from is away to start SGS bottles so will have to look into that.

They charge you for returning empties???

 

[Hood]

They charge you for returning empties???

Yes but I have no problem with that as someone has to pay for the transport and it is always the end user. What I object to is my bottle last month all in worked out cheaper than I was from Air Products, now it is quite a bit dearer, maybe even a lot dearer depending on how many I go through in the year.