Arc Welders - Cheap vs Expensive

[syborg]

lol i dunno about the flying aircraft but id rather blow a whole than strip off the landing gear in high winds,lol

my first project years and years ago was a bbq made of 2mm plate and 1.5 in 2mm wall tube so i couldnt realy go too wrong and i did get some good tidy welds using my first welder that cost me 80 quid from the littlewoods catalogue and it only goes up to 100 amps. no fan, no oil just air cooled, it would overheat every hour or so but its never let me down and still does nice tidy welds on thin stuff,

check out my thread on arc art, u can see the kind of persistant beads i can get using the old plastic cheapy..

but anyway,

keep at it, make a few more bits and bobs with good clean steel and learn by your mistakes.

then when finances allow, cough up for a better one and keep the old one as a backup,

i prefer mma for some reason, i bought a 250 quid mig but just couldnt get it right, probably cos i was young and had no sence of relentless patience where now i could probably do a fairly half decent job, but for now stick is my welding of choice.

bit like choosing bmx or skateboard....just one of them things, u either got it or you havent,


peace

syborg.

 

[premmington]

I have read this thread from start to the finish!

I am in the motortrade (I own a garage). We have an expensive Miller MIG welder here and oxygen and propane.

But we have a 210amp Clark AC buzzbox also!

I often get it out for repair work! Odd bracket repair, cracked stainless exhaust repairs. Welding sockets to things, making tools!

It strikes a 3.25mm rod up OK. I have never ever done a job where I have used more than three or four rods at a time, so it never has cut out.

It must be twenty years old, it may not have been new when I took the garage over.

Truthfully, everybody I know has had problems with cheap inverters.

I would buy a secondhand Oxford oil cooled set, if I could find one cheap enuf.

For an occasional little repair job, the Clark buzzbox can't be bettered.

Yes I have used big industrial DC sets. Yes they are better!

But for a little repair job, the clark arc welder offers a bit more penetration and portability than our MIG welder.

You would never make a ship with it. But if you want to weld a socket to a bit of square bar to hammer over a broken locking wheel nut in a garage it can't be bettered for the purchase price.

 

[Bill Edwards]

Interesting that you say 'everyone I know has had problems with cheap inverters'.
What problems? Presumably they're just packing up, how long have they been lasting and have they ever been dismantled to find and possibly rectify the faults? Any experience of the expensive ones as a comparison?

I could certainly understand cheaper ones going wrong, but I've not noticed forum posts asking for help on repairs.

 

[Jan]

As with many things in life, you only get the value that you pay for. A cheap item can work out expensive, while an expensive one can work out cheap. You can buy a Porsche for under 2K (I know where there's one going for £1700 ono), but you can expect it will take at least as much again before it will be reliable - or safe On the other hand you might just 'drop onto' something that's seriously undervalued that will last, untouched, for many years. It's all in the luck of the draw

 

[Bill Edwards]

I'd still be interested to know what the actual faults are, and what would be involved in repairing them for people with a basic understanding of electronics and a soldering iron.

 

[J.B. Welding]

I'd still be interested to know what the actual faults are, and what would be involved in repairing them for people with a basic understanding of electronics and a soldering iron.

The world of inverter repairs is something I've dabbled in-and faults often range from a simple internal fuse blown to a chip thats gone wrong/cooked. From getting things like this professionally repaired (and paying for it, ouch!) I've foung that the easy and expensive way is just to replace whole circuit boards until the machine is cured, when often it is just a simple component at fault (like a 10p resistor). Depending on the type of fault a trouble shooting chart can be followed and the path of the electricity can be followed through the unit as it travels through transformers, resistors, diodes, transistors and chips etc. There are set methods for testing such components which can implemented with a good multimeter and a lot of patience. When your finally work out whats wrong its then possible to to do the repair-there is always something wrong with a broken down machine, finding it is the tricky bit.

 

[Bill Edwards]

I would imagine getting hold of any circuit diagrams to work off must be almost impossible?

 

[Specialist]

As I'm getting to be active in welding again after some time, and now that I work with both the cheap buzzbox (although an substantial 200A one) and also an 180 Amp new good quality inverter, I must say it is worth it to get the quality set for anyone who is planing on welding more then few times a year.

The ease of use, predictability of arc, and portability are all important factors. Buzzbox can still be of use with a steady hand, and I'm kinda fond of the buzzing sound it makes, but in reality, I now almost exclusive using the inverter.

 

[dannyp]

i found the thermal arc 175A inverter works well for me, good value for money, duity cycel is ok it has enough power, and not massivly power hungery.

i've had a few buzz boxes still got one and used meany more includeing the aldi things. for £19 you get something that can burn a rod. i regualy spend more than that on cabels , £19 is pritty much a box of cheep rods. my last surviving buzz box is an old SIP turboweld 8, think it somethgin like 190 or 200 A, burns 6013's lovely and tobe fair to it will runn of some ropey genorators and not complain. it's duity cycel in managable can burn 15 3.2 one after another without stoppping the dust in it starts to smell and the abels are getting warm but it's still going and the cuttout hadn't kicked in and i got bored of trying to make it. the only down sides to it are it weighs 40KG gobbels power and it's AC, woud be nice if it's ocv was higher as well, bit never yet found a buzz box that'll burn low hy rods.


the small cheep boxes, seem to have ali windings, use scary amount of power compared to the usefull output they give. they probaly very usefull for meany people tht just want to burn a rod tho. but if you put it WORK it'll die quick the thermal cutouts give up after a while, so then they get bypassed so you can finish the job. usally on the next job you hear a fizzel and pop to your right as the lights go out. then you go and buy an inverter