cheb
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How do you rebore a horse (please don’t answer that, I don’t think I want to know...)
It's a hard job but some has to do it.
- Thread starter hotponyshoes
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It's a hard job but some has to do it.
Munkul
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To me, it's not maths, it's more cost effectiveness and bang for buck.
You'll want a relatively high flow in AND out of the horse bath - ideally what, 4 cube of water in less than half an hour? Any slower and it makes it a bit of a faff. So 8000lph min.
it would make sense to have a gravity flow from a higher tank into the horse bath. So you'll fill the tank in a few minutes.
When finished, use a 8000 lph (135 lpm, or 30 gpm) pump to push it back up to around 3m higher (2m for the top tank base, 1m height of tank)
Or, have a 3rd, lower tank sunk into the ground, for fast drain, and use a small pump to push it back up to the top tank. But I can't see it being cheaper than a decent pump.
A pump system lets you filter out crap and add chem treatment, maybe a bit of chlorine dosing, etc.
You'll want a relatively high flow in AND out of the horse bath - ideally what, 4 cube of water in less than half an hour? Any slower and it makes it a bit of a faff. So 8000lph min.
it would make sense to have a gravity flow from a higher tank into the horse bath. So you'll fill the tank in a few minutes.
When finished, use a 8000 lph (135 lpm, or 30 gpm) pump to push it back up to around 3m higher (2m for the top tank base, 1m height of tank)
Or, have a 3rd, lower tank sunk into the ground, for fast drain, and use a small pump to push it back up to the top tank. But I can't see it being cheaper than a decent pump.
A pump system lets you filter out crap and add chem treatment, maybe a bit of chlorine dosing, etc.
Happy_welder22
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I’d say level. If you are pumping up aren’t going to fully get the energy back on the way down. Also the path of the water has an effect.
Screwdriver
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Mass is something else, it is an entirely different "thing". Everything in this universe is "energy" (whatever that is) being manipulated by fields of force along prescribed geometries, often mediated by stranger expressions of energy (types of particle), blah blah.
The point being, weight is an emergent phenomena. It is derived from behaviours we can observe and not a fundamental property of matter/energy; in this example it is the way that mass behaves in a gravitational well. Interestingly we can describe gravity, predict what it will do but no current theory can explain what it is or even how it works!
One thing is for certain though, if you want to move a bucket of water up or down in a gravitational field, it will require or release a well known, precisely defined amount of energy and no end of cleverness will change that other than to mitigate the potential losses as energy squirms around determined to dissipate and find equilibrium.
Maker
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A quick google and fag packet calculation; here's the first 800l/m pump I found and it's only 400 watts, that'll do your 4000L tank in 5 minutes. 400 watts for 10 minutes is 0.07KWh, apparently the average price per unit of electricity in the UK is 15 pence so a full fill/drain cycle will cost you a single penny, is it really worth messing about with massive rotisseries, buried sumps, lifting gantries and talking about outer space for some reason for that kind of saving?
daleyd
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Wot he said^^. Plus with a pump system you can automate the whole thing with a few cheap float switches, solenoids etc. Push a button, go off and do something else while the tanks do their thing. Push another button and they do something else. You’ll probably save more in time (which may be worth more to you/your client) than you will ever hope to save in energy if you design it right.
Screwdriver
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An interesting question which highlights the issue with transforming energy and that is efficiency and losses.
A small electricity generator, let's say, driven directly by mains pressure out of a tap is going to generate a tiny amount. The precise number canbe calculated (be my guest) but is likely to be circa 0.1KW/h. That's if the system is 100% efficient and it is very much not, especially at that scale and at such low pressure. The generator will get hot, make noise and even the wiring will be lossy (especially at such low level).
Plus of course even if you could extract ALL of the potential (lit, kinetic) energy out of your water flow, it will then be static and just sit there, unless you "pay" to move it. The water will also heat up as it gets churned bythe turbine. I'm going to take a flying guess and say 0.05KW/h might just be possible.
On the other hand if it's free energy you want, you will get (on average) about 1KW for every square metre from solar radiation. Easily ten times more energy, no moving parts, directly converted into easy to use electrical power.
Finally, it does seem a bit of a long way round to use up water pressure to make electricity, to then use that electricity to generate water pressure in a pump (with all those cascading losses). Why not just use the actual water pressure already present in the mains without converting it and adding to the inexorable rise in entropy though a cascade of inefficiencies and losses, not to mention complexity?
Munkul
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Just make sure you calculate the flowrate at the head height needed. That pump only has a max head height of 3m, no idea what its flow rate is at that head... But likely enough to get it done in 20-30 mins
julianf
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As above - horses eat money. What's anyone worried about a bit more pumping cost?
In my previous example, I mentioned Manhatten apartments - you're on that end of the scale. If you need to stack them 10 high, if you've got the customers, who cares what it costs to pump the water? The 10 mins of Monday morning will probably cover the weeks power bill...
In my previous example, I mentioned Manhatten apartments - you're on that end of the scale. If you need to stack them 10 high, if you've got the customers, who cares what it costs to pump the water? The 10 mins of Monday morning will probably cover the weeks power bill...
