3mm Al/Al & LCS weld exemplars. Part1

[runnach]

Preparing today for block two session starting very soon. Welding up exemplars with details written on each one, thought it would be a good idea to share around with other budding tiggers.

Plant: Lincoln Electric 3 phase Invertec 305T AC/DC Inverter.

Tungsten: Ceriated 2.4 dia.

Gas: Argon @ 10 LPM.

Rods: See pic for spec.

LCS Corner & Butt joints: Root run using 1.6 dia filler, Capped using 2.4 dia. Remainder of LCS joints: 1.6 dia filler rod.

Al/Al: All joints made with single pass using 2.4 dia filler. Butt gapped @ 2.4mm, corner gapped @ 1.5mm. Same for LCS Butt & Corner.

Gaps and amp settings are what I work with, others may do different, all down to preference really!

Malcolm, feel free to tidy up pics and, select/delete using your judgement on picture quality.

Cheers...............

Oops, can only upload ten, more to come........

 

[runnach]

3mm Al/Al & LCS weld exemplars. Part2

More exemplars............

 

[runnach]

3mm Al/Al & LCS weld exemplars. Part3

Finally you say...............

 

[oceanobsession]

Re 3mm al/al & lcs weld exemplars part1

Some great examples or should i say exemplars. runnach im still trying to
master the t fillet. the butt joint seems the easy one i havent tried the rest
yet. i did get to have a go with a murex tradestig 253is i think that was the
model. it did roar on ac but i put a t fillet down on a piece of 2mm no promlem
it did seem easy to use compared with mine. what is the difference between a
open corner and a normal corner.also what is 1g and 2f. you seem to use
more amps than me also you seem to use more wire does this mean im not using enough wire. i seem to have a problem getting the heat right into the
corner both pieces seem to want to get away from each other than melt. i
did not have this problem with the murex tradestig 253is both pieces seem to melt lovely havent given up on it yet though cheers ocean

last nights effert

 

[Drains]

Nice one Terry. Is that what i've got to do tomorrow?

Er, i'll do me best...

Si

 

[runnach]

Nice one Terry. Is that what i've got to do tomorrow?

Er, i'll do me best...

Si

Yup Si, or similar, but using your feet, just make sure they are clean and spray on some nice smellie stuff just in case , to make things sligthly easier, BigJoe can feed the wire using his BigToe

Joking apart, I'll do a few to get the feel o the plant, then you guys can make the most of the materials.

Cheers........the morraw around midday.

 

[runnach]

Hi Oceans, working through your reply: I would say 2mm is not very easy for a learner to kick off with, 3mm is my start point, then moving down to 1.6mm. I do realise there are times when you can only use what is available tho. Butts are a dawdle, down hand (1G) compared to T-fillet (2F) Believe me, I have used old transformer plant numerous times in the past and, kicking off a T-fillet has given me probs (AC) with the arc dancing around all over the place. Just a case of joining up both side of joint and chasing the weld along till complete!

When starting T-Fillet, aim for the very end of sheet (where you would start) Assumming it is already tacked around this area, create weld pool and continue.....L((((((((((((((((((((((( till complete, if you stop, say half way along, back step 4>5mm create weld pool and (((((((((((=========== Filler wire directed straight into the semi keyhole created by the arc.

AC will always sound harsher than DC, this is common, even on Inverters.

Open corner: /\ edges not butted up closing the joint, I use around 1.6 gap to ensure good penetration. Easier for the arc force to burn away the edges to create a keyhole, then fill before keyhole opens up too far!!

More amps: I should have stated I can use more amps due to experience, I can co-ordinate torch hand and filler hand with eae compared to a learner. Thus said, if I was working to a weld procedure sheet (WPS) I would work within the WPS amperage range and, adjust speed of travel to suit.

More wire: For a butt, I want good pene, I also want reasonable build up on the face side of weld, above the flush of sheet. T-Fillet, again good fusion (although a macro etch or destructive test will confirm) Most important is one is trying to achieve a good throat thickness 45 degree profile, minimum convexity, same for concavity. Again, if working to a WPS, it determine leg length, throat thickness. There isa formula, but at the moment senior moment is kicking in 1.707x material thickness?


Stick at it Oceans, you will get there with practice practice practice.

Cheers.........

 

[Nathan]

Awesome welds!

 

[hotrodder]

Some good targets for your students to strive for there Runnach. What's part two? Nick breaks, macro's and bends or pipe? 1.707 T for throat thickness... rings a bell

Ocean,
diagrams of the different welding positions. Your consistancy is improving lots but those fillets are quite 'grainy' which is typical when you've got everything a bit too hot (especially with 4043 filler). Adding more filler would help (you can see how much closer the ripples are in Runnachs examples- 70-80% overlap on filler aditions) as it cools the puddle a bit. I'm thinking your arc length may be a bit long too but it's hard to tell without some references

 

[Kiwi K]

Awesome welds!

i agree but don't you just love to hate some people

gifted gitt

 

[oceanobsession]

Re 3mm al/al & lcs weld exemplars part1

thanks hotrodder. i was wondering about the grainyness of my welds its a
temperature thing then. would it be anything to do with the size of the pieces
im welding ie to small. keeping the tungsten close to the cup does seem better. melting the two pieces togeather you can angle the torch to melt
both surfaces the same then they seem to run away from each other so that
is when you add some rod then try to move the puddle which is always
different this is with everything the same as the last fillet you did sometimes
it will run other times the vertical fillet seems to open up so its in with the rod
but it still wont run you can put the tungstone close which will create a puddle but the puddle wont clean untill you move out further ive tried different angles and amps tungstens cups gas lpm levels tungsten shape i cant seem to get any consistency in what i am doing when i get a good
looking weld i dont seem to have done anything different from before my best
setup seems to be 2.4 tungsten sharpen to a point let arc create a ball size 6
cup tunsten out passed cup 4mm 8 lpm argon 85 amps anyway im not giving
up on the set yet but i do fancy a inverter with amp control on the pedel cheers ocean

 

[oceanobsession]

Re 3mm al/al & lcs weld exemplars part1

Hello again . just an update from earlier im now welding larger pieces with
better results cheers ocean

 

[runnach]

i agree but don't you just love to hate some people

gifted gitt

Hehe cool reply Kiwi gifted ma erse, just a few decades dancing with the blue lady like any trade/skill you do it often enough, you get better & better, lamps are dimming a wee bit now, so hopefully a few years left in em

HotRodder, plenty stuff on the net re; macro etching, probably better images than I can do with my camera. Although destructive, bent coupons ect is a possibility in the future, as this is part of students work.

Pipe: very possible too, I already have SummitSkills Examiners ticket on O&A & MMA welding processes. Want the same for TIG & MIG, anyone wanting these tickets require to test out, 2" & 4" carbon pipe, problem is TIME!! When I find some, I'll rattle off a few pics.

Hope others found exemplars useful?

Cheers...............

 

[runnach]

Hello again . just an update from earlier im now welding larger pieces with
better results cheers ocean

Yup, easier with larger pieces, more area for heat to dissipate.

Good stuff, stick in.

Cheers.

 

[hotrodder]

I was just being nosey re. pt2 Runnach, pt1 brought back memories of doing coupons like those you posted and then having to do the destructive testing myself (lazy bloody instructers!). Lap welds were macroed, fillets and open corners subjected to both a nick break and macro, butts were just bent. Given the simplicity of the tests and the amount they reveal thought it might be useful for the forum. As you say getting good macro pics might be a challenge. Don't know how easy it is come by nital these days but battery acid highlights the fusion zone reasonably well- probably not good enough for pics though. Can't even remember the reagents for Al or stainless beyond them containing some of the nastier acids

Ocean, re. the pool splitting and running apart... As Runnach said 3mm is quite a bit more forgiving with fillets. Might just be your wording but i read it as though you have two seperate puddles (just looked again and i can see two distinct puddles at the starts and stops) rather than one. Very small changes of torch angle (relative to vertical) will move the puddle, if the arc length is on the long side/amps are a shade low it will magnify the effect

Welding faster with a little more heat helps- Al, stainless and carbon... i often use lots of small autogenous (no filler) tacks when fitting things up, bring the heat up slowly and (especially with Al and stainless) the edges melt back leaving a hole but a quicker, hotter 'burst' and the edges fuse together

First thing i'd do is break open your test pieces and look for lack of fusion- i suspect they'll be OK except for at the starts/stops. There should be no evidence of a cut edge left within the weld- if the cut edge is still visible then you have LOF at the root.

The line between success and failure is quite fine with thin Al. It'll come with a bit more practice, one day soon it'll probably just 'click'

 

[Sparkey]

Blimey Terrr! some blo**y sexy beads you put down there!!!!Great!!!

 

[Bigjoe]

I'll post pics of how not to Tig weld ally tomorrow, in my defence i have never tig welded ally before .........so stand by!

Bigjoe

 

[Drains]

Me and Joe had the pleasure of watching Terry lay down beads like that yesterday - our own little tutorial. Now we know how it should be done! (pics to follow to find out if any of his years of skill have rubbed off)

 

[runnach]

Blimey Terrr! some blo**y sexy beads you put down there!!!!Great!!!

LOL @ "sexy beads" lass, first time I have heard it said in such a manner I nearly had a new screen saver, was having a wee swallie o coffee when I first viewed, Nescafee doesnae look too braw on the screen

Anyways, I've borrowed it, copyright pending

Cheers............

 

[runnach]

Me and Joe had the pleasure of watching Terry lay down beads like that yesterday - our own little tutorial. Now we know how it should be done! (pics to follow to find out if any of his years of skill have rubbed off)

Yup, very productive afternoon we all had. Joe, your being a tad modest, you did very well for 1st attempt on al/al. With Si having practical experience on tig carbon, twas just a case observing, dotting the iiiiii's and crossing the tttt's.

I'm looking forward to viewing future progress from you both

Lorch TIG ac/dc plant sure was sweet to use............cheers Matt, report heading your way soon.

Cheers...........

Ps, Joe, viewed your txt this morning, thanx & your welcome......