Time served, experienced,semi skilled & skilled????

[Ben88]

So these are some of the titles i've seen on job adverts am i correct on thinking that Time served is apprentice trained, Experienced means you've had a good few years in the trade, Semi skilled means you've maybe done labouring for sometime an helped do some jobs, an skilled means you've had hands on experience for a number of years an maybe city & guilds or equivalent qualifications????

 

[brightspark]

time served = slave labour before your out of your time

 

[Wedg1e]

I've never seen any allowance for self-taught...

 

[Tinbasherdan]

I asked this at an agency. Apparently they do not consider jobs such as sheet metal work, steel work etc to be skilled jobs, they advertise them as semi skilled

 

[Keith 66]

I never did an apprenticeship, rather i went to tech college & went the city & guilds route, Then learnt my trade on the tools.
I have met many apprenticed tradesmen who were good & some less so.
The best ones have invariably been self taught as they had the motivation & drive to succeed in a trade that they loved.

 

[ronan]

We used to have a name for people who claimed to be tradesmen but hadn't served an apprenticeship in my old job.................chancers. As for agencies claiming trades are semi skilled, rubbish, i did a four year apprenticeship, over a dozen evening classes at the same time in everything from plc's, fluid power and welding, and then did a three year degree course, if they told me i was semi-skilled, the air would be blue.

 

[Keith 66]

We used to have a name for those who relied on an apprenticeship but werent actually very good, Prima donna's!

 

[ronan]

We used to have a name for those who relied on an apprenticeship but werent actually very good, Prima donna's!

Prima donna's with trade certs . So whats the situation ? A lad with a box of tools who one week decides he is a toolmaker, but things are slow at that trade, so the following week he decides he is going to be an electrician ?

 

[Spark plug]

Round these parts someone who dose a weeks night class then calls themselves a tradesman is a dilute'y

 

[CRB]

Do not even think about the plastic side of things.

I am a window maker.

 

[Keith 66]

Anyone who jumps from trade to trade is never going to learn it, however if a bloke stays at it for the duration ie 10,20 years or more because he genuinely loves the job he can easily be as good or better as any time served bloke who might not even like the trade he is in.

 

[ronan]

Anyone who jumps from trade to trade is never going to learn it, however if a bloke stays at it for the duration ie 10,20 years or more because he genuinely loves the job he can easily be as good or better as any time served bloke who might not even like the trade he is in.

People who don't like their trade normally don't stay in them, and of the couple of lads i know who didn't like their trade they only did it because their parents pressured them into it.

You have to look at it from a time served lads point of view too, a guy does a few day or evening courses over a year or 18 months, but claims he is the same trade as you are, after you doing a four or five year slog on apprentice wages, it does stick in the craw a bit.

 

[Wedg1e]

At this rate we'll be getting into whether service engineers should be called engineers...

Did I mention I'm a service... er...

To be fair, I've met car mechanics who should be engineers and engineers who couldn't change a car wheel.

 

[Wedg1e]

Anyone who jumps from trade to trade is never going to learn it, however if a bloke stays at it for the duration ie 10,20 years or more because he genuinely loves the job he can easily be as good or better as any time served bloke who might not even like the trade he is in.

I'll have 22 years in this job next month, I thought if I got 6 months to 2 years out of it I'd be doing well I couldn't say I enjoy it, but I look around and see what the alternatives are... shift work in factories, evenings, weekends, call-outs, targets... and I stay put.

 

[Kayos]

To be honest agencies just make it up as they go along

I'm time served, full apprenticeship and been doing the job 15 years, I've also never stopped gaining extra qualifications or experience in different areas

A good employer will see that and not class someone who actually knows a trade the same as some who's been on a 6 week "learn to be a gas engineer" course

 

[Pete.]

People who don't like their trade normally don't stay in them, and of the couple of lads i know who didn't like their trade they only did it because their parents pressured them into it.

You have to look at it from a time served lads point of view too, a guy does a few day or evening courses over a year or 18 months, but claims he is the same trade as you are, after you doing a four or five year slog on apprentice wages, it does stick in the craw a bit.

I've worked with people who spent their whole life doing a single trade from apprentice and a few of them did nothing but complain about how good it used to be and thoroughly resented having to keep doing the same job they have chosen to stick to. Consequently, I don't judge people by what they have done - I judge them by what they do. If I were an employer I wouldn't give a hoot about how they spent their first five years if they turnrd out good work in an safe and efficient manner.

 

[Tinbasherdan]

We used to have a name for people who claimed to be tradesmen but hadn't served an apprenticeship in my old job.................chancers. As for agencies claiming trades are semi skilled, rubbish, i did a four year apprenticeship, over a dozen evening classes at the same time in everything from plc's, fluid power and welding, and then did a three year degree course, if they told me i was semi-skilled, the air would be blue.

Same here, I'm a time served sheet metal worker. I just picked my gear up and walked out when he said that to me!

 

[gerrymoore]

The best description I ever heard...I worked as senior engineer for a very large electronics manufacturer on the production their new digital telephone exchange known then as 'system X'. A lot of guys had worked there for years but had little or no electronics knowledge or experience...they were known as 'functioneers'

 

[addjunkie]

I work for a large multi national, a young high flyer, (you need to be nice to these guys when you train them as they always reapear as your boss, on their pre determined route to the top), said to me over the phone when i was trying to point him down the right route with a procedure he was writing. Youve not got a degree so you can be called an engineer. I said fine, but your procedure is still crap and wont work.

He duly arrived at site procedure all approved, to lead the task. Asked me for 4 guys to do the work. The one with the brains read his procedure and said it wont work, who wrote this rubbish. He gave them his engieer line.

I left them arguing for half an hour, before i pointed out, engineer or not, you still need to have a clue. His response was well it looks much flatter on a drawing. Shame no one had ever actually taught him how to read said drawing properly.

10 years later, our paths have crossed many times, he is now a boss, but always asks for advice from guys who do, rather than guys who talk about it. So I guess he learnt something that day.

One day i will show him the piece of paper i have from the governmet that i worked hard to get that says im a class 1 marine engineer!

 

[tomsutton529]

I work for a large multi national, a young high flyer, (you need to be nice to these guys when you train them as they always reapear as your boss, on their pre determined route to the top), said to me over the phone when i was trying to point him down the right route with a procedure he was writing. Youve not got a degree so you can be called an engineer. I said fine, but your procedure is still crap and wont work.

He duly arrived at site procedure all approved, to lead the task. Asked me for 4 guys to do the work. The one with the brains read his procedure and said it wont work, who wrote this rubbish. He gave them his engieer line.

I left them arguing for half an hour, before i pointed out, engineer or not, you still need to have a clue. His response was well it looks much flatter on a drawing. Shame no one had ever actually taught him how to read said drawing properly.

10 years later, our paths have crossed many times, he is now a boss, but always asks for advice from guys who do, rather than guys who talk about it. So I guess he learnt something that day.

One day i will show him the piece of paper i have from the governmet that i worked hard to get that says im a class 1 marine engineer!

Ahh the good old "ive been to uni" line.. I come across many people like that and they have never picked up a spanner. It winds me up when people say I cant be an Engineer because I haven't been to uni, I usually ask them what the hell am I doing in here if your so good. To be fair though Not many uni's cover Vibration Analysis, Balancing and alignment, some gloss over it but there is a lot more to be gained from on the job experience, learning from your mistakes and other courses like Mobius provide.