- Thread starter F.J.
- Start date
the snooper
getting older by the day
- Messages
- 21,078
- Location
- Hull UK
its always akward when this happens and the law really isnt on the suppliers side, it makes out to be but if this was the case the people that purposly rip bussineses off would be dealt with and stopped from doing it again but in the real world they close one company and start another and so the cycle begins again
F.J.
The least I know, the least i am responsible for
- Messages
- 1,845
- Location
- England
He openly admitted to loving what i built for him and also said there would be more to come so I don't think he could counter sue on product quality, plus wouldn't he have had to say something first regarding quality rather than sit on it hoping I would forget about getting paid? I will admit that I took longer than first estimated but it was a bespoke product, there was a lot of going back and forth with meetings and telephone conversations and deciding on what parts/materials to use.
After reading all your comments I realise I need to be a bit more firm when asking for what's owed. He even admitted that the job should of been built and sold before he even told me about it and that he had a 50% deposit and spent it!!!!
I've given him until Friday then ill be issuing other means of retrieving my money. I will even go as far as taking back the product if its still there as I know how much it will sell for and as he hasn't paid for it, it doesn't belong to him?
cecotto479
Member
- Messages
- 325
I'm afraid it does. Just because he hasn't paid for it doesn't mean it still belongs to you.
He owns it. He owes you money. Ownership transferred when you agreed to sell it and handed it over unless there is a clause in your paperwork stating something to the effect that ownership does not transfer until full payment has been received.
He owns it. He owes you money. Ownership transferred when you agreed to sell it and handed it over unless there is a clause in your paperwork stating something to the effect that ownership does not transfer until full payment has been received.
Dev
8th generation, Weyland type
- Messages
- 1,358
http://www.lawdonut.co.uk/law/comme...ry/getting-your-goods-back-if-you-aren-t-paid
Probably doesn't help you for this guy but good to know for the future.
Probably doesn't help you for this guy but good to know for the future.
mike os
just a little insane.....
- Messages
- 9,809
- Location
- North Wales
NIKK a charge against the property is the way to proceed.... it is a very useful legal device ( its how secured loans work), he cannot dispose of the property while the charge is there (ie cant even give it away), causes real financial difficulties if he wants to remorgage or borrow against the property... cant remember all the details but from what I recall it is not a hard thing to do...
Also did you supply to a private individual or a company?
Also did you supply to a private individual or a company?
ajlelectronics
Member
- Messages
- 10,813
- Location
- Gloucester, England
There is a sliding scale. Costs £25 for under £300. Then if it goes to a hearing, there is another £25 "hearing fee". I am currently doing one against a seller of a dangerous vehicle.
One point to be aware of when the defendant is some distance away, is that the case is heard in THEIR local court.
If you do take court action, the judges seem to like lots of paperwork that makes the case simple and straightforward to understand. Then it is a case of "Desiderata". ;-)
One point to be aware of when the defendant is some distance away, is that the case is heard in THEIR local court.
If you do take court action, the judges seem to like lots of paperwork that makes the case simple and straightforward to understand. Then it is a case of "Desiderata". ;-)
Gritineye
Member
- Messages
- 2,101
My daughter was working in collections for one of the big banks, her job was to secure an agreement to repay a dept that would hold up in court if need be.
I had a customer owing a very large amount, she wrote the following script for me, to give me confidence, it assumes that the work is satisfactory and there are no problems other than a reluctance to pay.
Do not talk on the doorstep, be polite and get sat down in doors.
Do not deviate from the script, and do not get drawn into an argument, remain silent when he is answering, then pause before asking the next question, remain calm and talk slowly, pauses are good.
It is OK to have the script in your open briefcase to glance at, check it whilst he is talking, his answers will be mostly irrelevant anyway. Look at him when you are talking.
---------------------------
Establish the cause:
1 Why haven’t you paid me?
2 What is the reason for the delay?
“No money, had to pay so-and-so, had to pay for this that & the other”
3 Okay – don’t respond.
Levy Professional Discomfort:
1 Why did you think it was acceptable to pay so-and-so before you settled with me?
“We had an agreement, they can’t survive if I don’t pay them”
2 Okay - don’t respond.
3 Why didn’t you contact me to tell me that there was a problem/delay?
“Phone cut off, didn’t have time, I thought it would be ok any day now”
1 Okay – don’t respond.
2 Why haven’t you paid me anything at all? Why have you not sent me a part payment as a gesture of goodwill?
“Haven’t had the extra cash, too busy”
3 But you have already told me that you have made time and had money to pay other people.
4 From my point of view, so far you have decided to prioritise other people above me, when I was the principle contributor to the build, you have not paid when you said you would, and then failed to explain your problems to me out of courtesy. Can you see how this would lead me to believe that you have a lack of commitment to pay me?
“Oh no that’s not the case, how can you think that?”
5 Given what I’ve just said and what you’ve told me today how can I not think that?
“Well yes, ok.”
Give Consequences:
1 I feel that I have offered you as much flexibility as possible, and that I have not pressured you about this and that I have upheld my end of our agreement.
2 This situation can’t continue. I have paid all the tax on the money outstanding, which is losing me interest at the bank. As this has been going on so long at this moment in time I have little confidence in your commitment to our agreement.
3 If we don’t arrive at a firm resolution to this today I am going to have to take it further/contact my solicitor.
“Well what does that mean? What do you intend to do?”
Negotiation:
1 I obviously don’t want to go down that route – what are you going to do to assure me of your good intentions?
“Of course I’ll pay you… I’ll have a cheque to you next week.”
2 I need you to pay me the full amount £XXX and tell me a date when you will pay my interest £XXX.
“I can’t do that today – have not got funds like that.”
3 What can you do today to convince me that I don’t need to worry about this?
"Waffle waffle...etc.."
4 This is what I want today
A cheque – part payment
Written confirmation of amount outstanding and dates of when the full amount will be cleared including agreed amount of interest, no point in agreeing this if you can’t pay. If you can’t do it tell me now.
DO NOT LEAVE WITHOUT THIS IN WRITING
Secure payment:
1 Is that a realistic proposal? Will you stick to this, have I got your personal guarantee?
Hope this of some use, I got all my money, 14k pus 1.9k interest, took 18 months from invoice date.
Bernard
I had a customer owing a very large amount, she wrote the following script for me, to give me confidence, it assumes that the work is satisfactory and there are no problems other than a reluctance to pay.
Do not talk on the doorstep, be polite and get sat down in doors.
Do not deviate from the script, and do not get drawn into an argument, remain silent when he is answering, then pause before asking the next question, remain calm and talk slowly, pauses are good.
It is OK to have the script in your open briefcase to glance at, check it whilst he is talking, his answers will be mostly irrelevant anyway. Look at him when you are talking.
---------------------------
Establish the cause:
1 Why haven’t you paid me?
2 What is the reason for the delay?
“No money, had to pay so-and-so, had to pay for this that & the other”
3 Okay – don’t respond.
Levy Professional Discomfort:
1 Why did you think it was acceptable to pay so-and-so before you settled with me?
“We had an agreement, they can’t survive if I don’t pay them”
2 Okay - don’t respond.
3 Why didn’t you contact me to tell me that there was a problem/delay?
“Phone cut off, didn’t have time, I thought it would be ok any day now”
1 Okay – don’t respond.
2 Why haven’t you paid me anything at all? Why have you not sent me a part payment as a gesture of goodwill?
“Haven’t had the extra cash, too busy”
3 But you have already told me that you have made time and had money to pay other people.
4 From my point of view, so far you have decided to prioritise other people above me, when I was the principle contributor to the build, you have not paid when you said you would, and then failed to explain your problems to me out of courtesy. Can you see how this would lead me to believe that you have a lack of commitment to pay me?
“Oh no that’s not the case, how can you think that?”
5 Given what I’ve just said and what you’ve told me today how can I not think that?
“Well yes, ok.”
Give Consequences:
1 I feel that I have offered you as much flexibility as possible, and that I have not pressured you about this and that I have upheld my end of our agreement.
2 This situation can’t continue. I have paid all the tax on the money outstanding, which is losing me interest at the bank. As this has been going on so long at this moment in time I have little confidence in your commitment to our agreement.
3 If we don’t arrive at a firm resolution to this today I am going to have to take it further/contact my solicitor.
“Well what does that mean? What do you intend to do?”
Negotiation:
1 I obviously don’t want to go down that route – what are you going to do to assure me of your good intentions?
“Of course I’ll pay you… I’ll have a cheque to you next week.”
2 I need you to pay me the full amount £XXX and tell me a date when you will pay my interest £XXX.
“I can’t do that today – have not got funds like that.”
3 What can you do today to convince me that I don’t need to worry about this?
"Waffle waffle...etc.."
4 This is what I want today
A cheque – part payment
Written confirmation of amount outstanding and dates of when the full amount will be cleared including agreed amount of interest, no point in agreeing this if you can’t pay. If you can’t do it tell me now.
DO NOT LEAVE WITHOUT THIS IN WRITING
Secure payment:
1 Is that a realistic proposal? Will you stick to this, have I got your personal guarantee?
Hope this of some use, I got all my money, 14k pus 1.9k interest, took 18 months from invoice date.
Bernard
Gritineye
Member
- Messages
- 2,101
The idea is that you know roughly what he is going to say because most people want to appear reasonable, just pretend to listen patiently to all his excuses (but be preparing your scripted response), wait till he has run out of things to say before your next response.
Just pause if he interrupts, this makes you appear unflappable and in control, while he knows he is in the wrong.
Never answer any questions from him, or be swayed by excuses, barristers and salesmen use similar methods to get their way.
iphones didn't exist back then, but I would be secretly recording the whole conversation on mine nowadays.
I really hope that he coughs up Friday, but if he doesn't you should feel a lot less nervous about a meeting doing it this way, calm and polite, good luck!
Bernard
.
That sounds favourable,he's a private individual.
the snooper
getting older by the day
- Messages
- 21,078
- Location
- Hull UK
and if he doesnt want to sell or remortgage you are no better off
Last edited:
pidgeon chit welder
sticking metal since 1962
- Messages
- 961
I think you have to have a court case in your favour first .
Well worth using search engines to see if you can get a lie of the land so to speak before you go to a solicitor etc.
This is what I've just searched and found ...it is called a lein .
http://uk.answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20090207124531AAlBurK
This is answer was dated 2004
