How would you machine this?

[Thomo]

Hey Guys,

Hoping you can give me a few clues here.

How you would go about machining the object on the right?

Basically I am trying to ascertain whether or not this is CNC only or if it could be done on a Hobbyist milling machine/ Lathe like a Clarke CL250M?

I have no experience in using a Lathe or Milling machine but would love to learn and if this is the kind of thing I could machine then I might pull the trigger on one of these sooner than later.

Any input would be much appreciated.

Cheers
Thomo

 

[scott0031]

Fist question, what size is it? approx dimensions. It Looks fairly small from the pics but they can be deceiving with no scale to go by. Not hard to machine manually, but time consuming as with all manual machining. Depending on the size it could be doable on' Decent' hobby machines. Machines like Clark junk...................... forget it, save your cash for proper machines. Remember though, buying the machine is only a small part of the set up........... tooling is extensive and costly for decent stuff that will do the job well.


Kind regards,



Scott

 

[stormin]

I'm assuming it's made from aluminium. All looks quite within the possibilities of manual milling or turning for the home machinist with a bit of practice and a manual machine.
If you want to do them for profit, your not going to turn them out as cheaply as the chap who already has a cnc machine and the gcode to machine it.

Looking at the part the vast majority of the machining could be done on a milling machine only using a boring head for the round areas. I'm sure a lot of lathe only men will say it can all be machined on a lathe as well if you fit a vertical slide.

One thing I wouldn't recommend is a new hobby machinist to go out and purchase one of the Clarke mill lathe multi machines. They've been discussed on here quite a bit and may just be enough to put you off machining for life.

My advice would be to get a decent lathe or mill to start off with. Practice a lot to find out what you can and cannot do and improve your accuracy. You will also find out ways of extending the capability of your machine with bought or home made modifications. When you've had several months practice have a go at the item in question but be prepared not to get it right first time. After several years you may decided you've compromised enough or you need more capability and get the other machine be it lathe or mill.

 

[GeorgiePorgie]

I don't think it is machined? summat tells me its casted? I'd attempt to sand cast this in Aluminium and clean it up afterwards,but sometimes if the sandcasting is done to perfection its not necerssary.

 

[brightspark]

i might be wrong but it looks as though its been die cast

 

[scott0031]

I don't think it is machined? summat tells me its casted? I'd attempt to sand cast this in Aluminium and clean it up afterwards,but sometimes if the sandcasting is done to perfection its not necerssary.

I am as sure as you can it's been machined. If these housings were produced in large volume, the origin could be an extrusion. I have doubts on that though as extrusions are always made of pappy ally that is easy to extrude, and sht to machine. I don't think it is a casting from original due to no tell tale signs. You will soon know if you machine some of the original housing.


Kind regards,


Scott

 

[scott0031]

i might be wrong but it looks as though its been die cast

If you look at pic 2 you can see the face has been turned, that does not mean the origin of the thing is not cast/ extrusion of some kind.

Edit: The part also 'looks' to be anodised, in which case it will very likely be an extrusion then machined/or a solid lump of ally. Casting of any kind are notoriously hard to anodise successfully with repeatable results.



Kind regards,


Scott

 

[graffian]

I think I would stick a chunk of ali on the mill, mill the flats and drill the holes.
then I would stick it in a 4 jaw and bore right thru, then machine one hose end and then turn it round in the chuck and machine the other hose end.
looks pretty simple;-) the other one looks more FUN, plenty of rotary table action. I wouldn't be surprised if it was an extrusion.
Here's a similar sort of thing, well it's turned and milled.

This just goes to show you shouldn't bin any odd bit's of metal, had that little bit of round stock in my scrap draw for a long time. Anyway a broken dynamo bearing housing, very common[to be broken] and I couldn't get one for right at that moment. second pic it's just been taken out of the lathe after turning on two centres and it accepts the bearings and registers on the dynamo, just needs all the swarf removing so the brushes can be bolted to it. as you can see it's all icy, I did this at Christmas when it was snowing. I ended up holding it in a lathe chuck in the mill.

After a rampant session with the mill it looked like so, I really should sort out some stops for the rotary table;-) I made it beefier where they crack, but it should be fine as it's not cast. warm it up to 80º or so and bearing pops in nicely. Here's the reassembled dynamo. The dynamo needed the bearing housing, the armature cleaning, re-threading the armature, making new armature nuts and the pin spanners to assemble it[no hitting my lovely new armature nuts with a punch]. So a lathe and a mill are pretty important bit's of kit.
I would be interested how scott would make your part?

 

[brightspark]

If you look at pic 2 you can see the face has been turned, that does not mean the origin of the thing is not cast/ extrusion of some kind.



Kind regards,


Scott

yes your rite it has been machined . the 1st picture in the top left looks to have a parting line on the left hand flange still .and i might still be wrong

 

[shenion]

Looks like a mass airfow sensor. Means it will be 60mm or larger. With some square or hex stock the right size it could be turned on a lathe but not a small hobby one.

 

[awemawson]

I assume it's a mass airflow sensor housing from the inlet side of an engine? I also assume that you want to make the whole thing and not just the cylindrical bit? Looking closely at the pictures I reckon it's injection moulded plastic. I also reckon if you've not machined before, then to attempt this as a first project will end in tears. The original mould would have taken very many highly skilled man hours to make using in all likelyhood a die sinking EDM machine, with the graphite or copper electrodes being machined on either conventiional or cnc mills and lathes.

 

[Wedg1e]

I was thinking it looks like a plastic AFM too: there's what appears to be a silver thread insert contrasting with the black of the body and the flat side of the body looks to be slightly textured... the turning marks could easily be the marks from the inside of the die used to cast the part.
I'm probably daft enough to try and copy it, I'd be looking for a big chunk of black acetal as a starting point

 

[Thomo]

Wow, Thanks for the great response.

Those that said it was a MAF sensor were correct.

This is for a 80 series Landcruiser. The one on the left is stock (moulded plastic), The one on the right is an after market housing with an updated MAF sensor. As you can see the after market one is far less restrictive, also the new sensor is more sensitive.
All in all the after market setup is good for a bit more power and improved throttle response. It has been made on a CNC and is anodised.

Size wise, Bore is approx 120mm. Length is 150mm.

So for someone new to machining and wanting to learn what would your recommendations be as to what type of second hand machine to go for?

I'd rather learn to make one then buy it, besides getting it from the states would set me back a good £500 with shipping and tax. Now I'd rather put that towards tooling.

 

[stormin]

If I was realistic about making such an item I would first off ask myself why is it not just made out of ally tube with the necessary bosses for mounting lugs and hot wire sensor mount welded on?
Yes it looks good being all machined out of billet ally but I'm sure you could get the same effect much cheaper.

As to the size of machine required, you could turn and bore the necessary size of that on a machine with anything over 5" centre height I guess. Harrison L5, Colchester Student to name a few. You be compromising on set up to machine flats on the faces of the angular part but it could be done.

A much smaller milling machine would probably suffice for much of the work. Again you'd be compromising on set-up on some points. Using a boring head externally to machine the outside of the pipe diameter, or mounting the item on a rotary table.

I would ask what else you intend to machine besides this one particular item before committing to any particular machine.

You can't beat having both a lathe and a milling machine but a lot can be done with just one of the two and a bit of ingenuity. I started of the lathe route as I figured most of my machining requirement orginally was round bushes and such.

 

[Pete.]

It's a hot wire MAF sensor.

There's a conquest mill on homeworkshop right now for £200 in Manchester.

Are you looking to make just one, or make money by making and selling them? If it's the latter I would give up now - that one was probably knocked out of an extrusion or casting in five minutes on a CNC machine.

 

[Engineer]

The parts pictured are mass airflow sensors, which are one piece injection moulded plastic. It would be possible to machine these in aluminium, but this would be very time consuming, and would mean several parts which needed to be screwed together.

However the main problem would be related to the fact that a metallic housing may well affect the performance of the MAF electronics in an adverse way, and mean that for anything other than a show car which was never intended to run, that this would be a complete waste of time anyway.

 

[Pete.]

The left is injection moulded but the right is black anodized aluminium.

 

[hareng]

Quite easy to do, just time consuming even on a robust large lathe probably looking 1 1/2hrs.

Forget the toy lathes like the two lesser Clarkes, Chesters, Warco, Siege etc all made in same factory. Unless you want to spend literally 40+hrs just on the lathe machining. Ok for wood, plastic and powering a flexi drive, thats it got one knocking around some where just about run in with grease still on.
The dia of that part is as large as the chuck, not a cat in hells chance!

Knew what it was straight away, just changed mine.
Any side effects to going that route?

 

[Thomo]

Hey Guys,
Just to answer a few quastions,

1. I am not looking at mass producing these, just a one off for myself and possibly a few others should a demand crop up.

2. The thing is I would really like to learn how to machine parts. I’m not sure what else I would machine, but I think once I start learning then there would be more bits I’d realise I might be able to make myself. Besides if you could make it yourself, why wouldn't you want to?

I have always been fascinated as to how things are made and I have decided it's time to learn how to make these things myself. So about a year ago I bought a welder and subsequently built myself a spare wheel carrier...

Now I would like to sell my rear bumper with carrier and make a complete unit from scratch (bumper and wheel carrier). So if I could also machine spindles and a carrier then that would be awesome.

3. The aftermarket MAF housing would enable me to run an updated MAF sensor that is more sensitive than the original as well as being less restrictive. Feedback on a few US Forums for Landcruisers is that there is better throttle response, steadier idle and an increase in power.
So the idea is to gain performance out of this.

So if something like this would be possible on a Milling machine (I have been looking at milling machines in ebay. Seems to be a few more options on there for less money than a lathe...)

What would your suggestions be? Also could I machine a spindle on a mill?

 

[GeorgiePorgie]

Look up sandcasting on youtube if your getting serious on making stuff and turning parts plus milling,it helps to understand how some parts are made easily and then cleaned and milled afterwards....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M95bhPrDwA0&feature=related

This is a series of vids but I thought this part was interesting.