What type of screws for attaching treated timber stud wall to masonry wall?

[6ply]

I need to screw some timber stud work to a masonry (red brick) wall. The stud work will be timber clad, vapour membrane, etc. and should stay dry, but just for peace of mind I am planning to use treated timber. I thought I might use "frame fixings" but have also read reminders to use fixings compatible with treated timber. So, if I want to screw lengths of 45 x 95 x 2400 C16 treated timber to a brick wall, can anyone suggest suitable fixings? I'll be screwing through the 45 mm section. Is there a standard recommendation for the spacing of fixings?

Additionally, I need to screw a timber sole plate (for the same stud work) down to a concrete pad. It appears dry but I doubt it has a DPC.

If interested, I am filling in the two open sides to this porch:

 

[gaz1]

they are called concrete screws buy long enough to go through your wood and into the wall normally about 4" with red brick

Rawlplug R-LX Zinc Plated Concrete Screw Anchor

Non-expansion bolt that can be used close to the edge, where conventional anchors will damage the material. Removable. zinc flake corrosion-resistant coating.

www.toolstation.com

you also want steel zinc washers as well as the bolt will pull through the wood

be warned red brick blows out at rear of the bricks with sds drills so drill so far and switch to normal drill with light banging with the drill itself

and its every 2ft along the length of the joist

the same is with the sole plate though id advise keeping the wood away from the base and use sacrifitial wooding that can be replaced when needed though plastic can be used

 

[Cobbler]

When I battened the wall of an outbuilding I was recommended to use Fischer frame fixings. Drilled through the wood & straight into the wall in one go.

 

[6ply]

they are called concrete screws buy long enough to go through your wood and into the wall normally about 4" with red brick

Rawlplug R-LX Zinc Plated Concrete Screw Anchor

Non-expansion bolt that can be used close to the edge, where conventional anchors will damage the material. Removable. zinc flake corrosion-resistant coating.

www.toolstation.com

you also want steel zinc washers as well as the bolt will pull through the wood

be warned red brick blows out at rear of the bricks with sds drills so drill so far and switch to normal drill with light banging with the drill itself

and its every 2ft along the length of the joist

the same is with the sole plate though id advise keeping the wood away from the base and use sacrifitial wooding that can be replaced when needed though plastic can be used

Gaz, do you think concrete screws are overkill for fixing the timber uprights to the wall? I was thinking of some type of frame fixing?

 

[6ply]

When I battened the wall of an outbuilding I was recommended to use Fischer frame fixings. Drilled through the wood & straight into the wall in one go.

That's the type of thing I was thinking of previously. Something like this?

 

[6ply]

Sole plate and studwork shown in this drawing. I was planning on sitting the sole plate onto a layer of DPC.

 

[8ob]

The concrete screws may be better, half of the frame fixers will end up in the frog of the brick.

Bob

 

[6ply]

When I battened the wall of an outbuilding I was recommended to use Fischer frame fixings. Drilled through the wood & straight into the wall in one go.

None of my hammer drill bits will go through timber (well, not easily). What do people use nowadays?

 

[gaz1]

that wood will get wet change to plastic 3x2 on the floor

as goes for the walls if you want sink in screws you can buy them as well ive only shown the beam type

Masonry Torx Frame Fixing Screw

Suitable for all common building and frame materials without the need for additional plugs. Use 6mm drill bit and a T30 Torx driver bit (code 46139).

www.toolstation.com

with red brick those plastic ones are no good as the rear has blown out

 

[gaz1]

None of my hammer drill bits will go through timber (well, not easily). What do people use nowadays?

use a wood drill first with battery drill if you have that then use sds drill through the hole

 

[Kayos]

If agree with @gaz1 the concrete fixings are a modern solution. If you wind one out it will need binning though

The hammer in fixings are better on block than brick, I like Fischer but on red brick the frogs or holes can be a problem

 

[nickk]

The concrete screws may be better, half of the frame fixers will end up in the frog of the brick.

Bob

He should be able to plot those on his stick of 4x2 with a mark.

 

[MattF]

That's the type of thing I was thinking of previously. Something like this?

View attachment 521072

You can get fixings which don't need a plug. Hole in the wall, & drive the fixing straight in.

Edit: The type @gaz1 has linked to in his second link.

 

[6ply]

that wood will get wet change to plastic 3x2 on the floor

as goes for the walls if you want sink in screws you can buy them as well ive only shown the beam type

Masonry Torx Frame Fixing Screw

Suitable for all common building and frame materials without the need for additional plugs. Use 6mm drill bit and a T30 Torx driver bit (code 46139).

www.toolstation.com

with red brick those plastic ones are no good as the rear has blown out

@gaz1 I wasn't aware plastic "timber" exists (apart from picnic benches, etc.) I guess you mean something like this? I'm still not entirely convinced it is necessary as the floor seems dry to me and I was planning on running a roll of dpc under the sole plate.

 

[6ply]

@gaz1 those torx screws look good and presumably they'd be fine with the red brick even if one or two entered a partly filled frog.

 

[knighty]

2nd or 3rd or 4th vote or however many we're up to now for the concrete screws in gaz 2nd link

I always just drill through wood with the sds when putting them in

6mm pilot hole for them going into brick / something hard, 5.5mm for something soft like breeze blocks

it doesn't need a load of fixing, just enough to hole it to the wall... are you fitting windows/doors or something there?

 

[6ply]

2nd or 3rd or 4th vote or however many we're up to now for the concrete screws in gaz 2nd link

I always just drill through wood with the sds when putting them in

6mm pilot hole for them going into brick / something hard, 5.5mm for something soft like breeze blocks

it doesn't need a load of fixing, just enough to hole it to the wall... are you fitting windows/doors or something there?

Thanks - I'm going for the @gaz1 suggestion of frame fixings

Masonry Torx Frame Fixing Screw

Suitable for all common building and frame materials without the need for additional plugs. Use 6mm drill bit and a T30 Torx driver bit (code 46139).

www.toolstation.com

Regarding the walls, my plan is timber studwork frame, with all the usual vapour membrane, insulation, etc. Battens plus cladding on the outside. One small high level window on the narrow end. Access door and one small window on the other elevation. The existing front door will be retained. They'll also be a dpc on the floor, some insulation (not much, due to levels), possibly capped off with ply and some timber laminate flooring.

 

[bricol]

Veering off the original question, I have a very similar style porch.

I measured the holes, went to my local plastic window component supplier, handed over measurements, a week later, two frames, solid lower infill panels, upper double glazed units delivered.

Fitted, sealed, forgotten.

 

[6ply]

Veering off the original question, I have a very similar style porch.

I measured the holes, went to my local plastic window component supplier, handed over measurements, a week later, two frames, solid lower infill panels, upper double glazed units delivered.

Fitted, sealed, forgotten.

Yes, I considered that option. Got a quote and didn't really like the end product / price.

 

[6ply]

Thinking about Gaz's suggestion earlier (plastic lumber) maybe I should consider running another course of bricks on the inside for the frame to sit on? I was hoping to fit the frame directly to the concrete slab for simplicity and keeping the wall insulated with no cold bridging at the bottom of the wall. As previously mentioned, I won't be able to bring the floor level up much at all.