Chinese machining on 1-offs?

[julianf]

I'm aware that there are firms on China whom you can send a 3d model to, and they will machine your part out of a single alloy billet for less than I can buy the billet for here...


...but does anyone know if any of them will do the same with cast iron?

My friend has this issue. It's old and rare enough that there may not be a spare available.

 

[frank horton]

I would cast in ally or bronze and fit an iron liner.....u could prob use the old cylinder as a pattern.....
Acually doesn't the guy in Newcastle cast up ally...plus he has all the machining facilities to complete the job.....
His name escapes me but not the language....hahaha...
or
plenty of foundries around the UK....
Look via google for a firm that adverises any kind / size of cylinder liners stocked for sale....
The also advertise in Stationary engine magazine and prob anything with vintage m/cycles...

 

[BrokenBiker]

I would cast in ally or bronze and fit an iron liner.....u could prob use the old cylinder as a pattern.....
Acually doesn't the guy in Newcastle cast up ally...plus he has all the machining facilities to complete the job.....
His name escapes me but not the language....hahaha...
or
plenty of foundries around the UK....
Look via google for a firm that adverises any kind / size of cylinder liners stocked for sale....
The also advertise in Stationary engine magazine and prob anything with vintage m/cycles...

@doubleboost

A cracking description by the way

 

[julianf]

To me (and this isnt my field at all) it looks way too thin to sleeve?

The engine is from the 1920s ish

 

[Kram]

What is it from? Single cyl or part of a larger engine?

Machined from CI billet wont be the same as one cast like the original. There are ways of casting CI on a small scale but its a complicated subject with different grades, heat treatments, aging etc..
Might be just as complicated to spec a billet to machine from - quite sure there are large books devoted to the subject!

I am sure China can do it but likely wont be the best quality.

Perhaps one for @oldbikedavey

 

[oldbikedavey]

What is it from? Single cyl or part of a larger engine?

Machined from CI billet wont be the same as one cast like the original. There are ways of casting CI on a small scale but its a complicated subject with different grades, heat treatments, aging etc..
Might be just as complicated to spec a billet to machine from - quite sure there are large books devoted to the subject!

I am sure China can do it but likely wont be the best quality.

Perhaps one for @oldbikedavey

That'll be fun, and not especially cheap to do.
Not impossible, though.
Iron foundry stuff is more complicated than some extremely complicated things, but once got a reasonable handle on, can obviously be done.

 

[Seadog]

What is it from? Single cyl or part of a larger engine?

Machined from CI billet wont be the same as one cast like the original. There are ways of casting CI on a small scale but its a complicated subject with different grades, heat treatments, aging etc..
Might be just as complicated to spec a billet to machine from - quite sure there are large books devoted to the subject!

I am sure China can do it but likely wont be the best quality.

Perhaps one for @oldbikedavey

Perhaps @zeppelin builder has a spare?

Or @Matchless

 

[Matchless]

I'm aware that there are firms on China whom you can send a 3d model to, and they will machine your part out of a single alloy billet for less than I can buy the billet for here...


...but does anyone know if any of them will do the same with cast iron?

View attachment 509928


My friend has this issue. It's old and rare enough that there may not be a spare available.

If he has most of the pieces I know someone who can repair that using metal spraying, he did repair two cylinders just like that for me a few years ago, they did not even need a rebore or sleeve as the damage is below the ring line,

 

[Ace Paul]

The engine is from the 1920s ish

Is this not covered by manufacturer warranty?

Local engine repair shop, see if they can identify something else to fit

 

[Onoff]

I tried JTR In China for a one off of these in 316. USD 128.00 Inc shipping. Thought it was steep tbh considering I provided the file.

https://flic.kr/p/2oeSjmb

 

[OJCar]

It's old and rare enough that there may not be a spare available.

What is the 1920s engine that its from?

( @8ob probably has one in his yard)

 

[julianf]

What is the 1920s engine that its from?

( @8ob probably has one in his yard)

They had some variations, but, basically, one of these -

Its a BSA V twin.


I dont know a lot about it. The owner is a good friend, but its not the sort of car im into, and my memory is poor, so things dont "stick" so well.

Ive always called it "the death mobile" as its, basically, a kids model plane (wooden frame with fabric or something) on three wheels with an engine.

 

[OJCar]

Its a BSA V twin.

OK, tell your friend to contact/join the BSA Front Wheel Drive Club, if not already a member.
Their website is https://www.bsafwdc.org/

Firstly, if anyone is going to know of spares for the BSA V Twin engine, derived from the Hotchkiss, its them.
Secondly, they own what survives of the Factory Drawings and they are available to their members.

The drawing that will particularly interest your friend is 35-1.
It shows the whole of the Fixed Head Barrel with all the dimensions.

This is a small part of drawing 35-1 that the BSAFWDC own.

( If he wants to see the rest he will need to get it from the BSAFWDC ).

 

[julianf]

OK, tell your friend to contact/join the BSA Front Wheel Drive Club, if not already a member.
Their website is https://www.bsafwdc.org/

Firstly, if anyone is going to know of spares for the BSA V Twin engine, derived from the Hotchkiss, its them.
Secondly, they own what survives of the Factory Drawings and they are available to their members.

The drawing that will particularly interest your friend is 35-1.
It shows the whole of the Fixed Head Barrel with all the dimensions.

This is a small part of drawing 35-1 that the BSAFWDC own.

View attachment 510205

( If he wants to see the rest he will need to get it from the BSAFWDC ).

He is all membered up, and has all the drawings. The club spares has been shut since the event - i guess he will know more tomorrow.


Im not asking on his behalf. I was asking as i was interested.

 

[zeppelin builder]

werent these a hotchkiss
engine , later ones had ford sidevalve
bound to be a few lying around

 

[OJCar]

later ones had ford sidevalve

None of them were fitted with a Ford Side Valve by BSA.
They were fitted with a BSA Side Valve.

 

[Jelly_Sheffield]

but does anyone know if any of them will do the same with cast iron?

They will do pretty much anything you pay them to, and at exactly the level of quality you're willing to pay for.

The main issue is ensuring very clear communication during quoting.

Lots of companies will have a rep who can communicate anywhere between ok to really very good in english...

But until you build a relationship with a manufacturer, you just can't be certain how well you're being understood, so have to make everything 100% clear, even when it seems patronising or stupid.

If I was doing something like this for work (and we do sometimes) I would pay the $38/HR for a specialist translator to produce a set of drawings or 3D model with all the relevant GD&T, and a covering letter detailing material spec, quantity etc. in mandarin, then approach a bunch of different companies and go for one which gave me good vibes in the communication, and quoted a price somewhere between the average and highest price.

By the time you're done (translator, pay the high end of Chinese prices to ensure you get in-spec parts, shipping, agents fees, duty, vat) it's not going to appreciably cheaper that having it made in the UK for a one-off.

If price is the biggest concern [after the parts being in tolerance] I would consider approaching firms in low cost of living European countries (Portugal, Czechia, Slovakia, Slovenia) or even Northern Ireland to machine it.

For comparison you can straight up farm it out to Xometry with full GD&T in the 3d model, and see what you get quoted from all over the world.