speed camera fine , who knows the rules

[arther dailey]

So poodling along just exiting a corner this road is 30mph and next sign is 40mph , so technically I am still in 30 zone as I come around the corner I notice what I thought to be some one with a theodalite but no one else about and no signage , realised then its a speed camera ..to late ,as I have just been notified I was doing 36 in the 30 zone , I was under the impression signs had to be put out ? anyways clocked the van snuck up around the corner out of site as I went past and the consequence I have just recieved a speeding ticket . My first offence ever @ 70 year old ! damn . I was of the understanding that everything was meant to be clearly insight rather than catching you as you exit a corner ? advice please, not saying I was nt speeding just want to know if it was done correctly .thanks

 

[ajlelectronics]

So poodling along just exiting a corner this road is 30mph and next sign is 40mph , so technically I am still in 30 zone as I come around the corner I notice what I thought to be some one with a theodalite but no one else about and no signage , realised then its a speed camera ..to late ,as I have just been notified I was doing 36 in the 30 zone , I was under the impression signs had to be put out ? anyways clocked the van snuck up around the corner out of site as I went past and the consequence I have just recieved a speeding ticket . My first offence ever @ 70 year old ! damn . I was of the understanding that everything was meant to be clearly insight rather than catching you as you exit a corner ? advice please, not saying I was nt speeding just want to know if it was done correctly .thanks

Sadly just another of their "honeypot" traps. I have had the same. You would think that any danger for that stretch would result in better signage, but no; Kerching.
I think the attitude is that unless you have passed a sign to the contrary, it is 30MPH regardless of how clearly ridiculous it is.

First time you should get an invitation to a "Speed awareness course" which involves a Green Meanie berating you with his fact that 1MPH over the arbitrarily set limit is as serious as knifing pedestrians. You will have to bite your lip and not try to interject with any common sense or you will get a direct threat to not be signed off as completed. Thought Police at their finest.

 

[Redsailor]

Alas nowadays it's hide 'n sneaky when it comes to these fund raising exploits. Favourite spot here on the edge of the village is similar to yours, exiting a 40 zone you come round a blind bend and muppet with a camera lurks in a layby adjacent to the pub. Fortunately all the locals know this and slow down just before the bend.

As a first offence and not too extreme you should be offered a speed awareness course. Take this if offered as it does not count as speeding offence conviction and usually does not affect your insurance. Do not mention it to your insurance company unless they specifically mention speed awareness course.

The course I did last year was quite an enjoyable affair, lots of laughs and jokes and the two guys presenting it were a good comedy double act.

 

[dieselsamurai]

The last one i did was on Zoom its all outsourced now , there used to be a dedicated team when I worked with the police. I did it at work luckily we were quiet as you can fail it for interruptions . The one before was in a hotel tea and biscuits from memory quite good actually didnt really learn anything but the people made it fun. Takes over 3hrs from memory

 

[knighty]

they're supposed to have signs out... but they're also only allowed to have cameras in accident black spots.... they just set the bar so low for an accident black spot that it covers pretty much every road :-(

waste of time trying to fight it

I did a speed awareness course via zoom a few weeks back, total waste of time... guy running the course outright lied about stopping distances etc. he went on for a long time that the difference between 30pmh and 31mph stopping distance is 5m :-o

 

[bricol]

Nope, no signs required. They might use them, some do, but there is nothing in law to say they have to. You already know the signs you needed to see, the 30 limit and the 40 limit

Speaking as someone caught at 35 in a 30, slowing down from a 40 . . ., problem was I was on auto-pilot, probably like you, and the 30 limit had been moved and started earlier, and I hadn't seen it. A lesson to be more observant.

Signs are required for fixed cameras.

 

[Jack_K]

You get signs?

Here they try to hide the cameras. Their latest attempt is to make them look like construction equipment.

I do believe they require signs in other states but not the one I'm in.

 

[gaz1]

still a 30 until you hit the 40 so being naughty yourself you picked speed up to 40 and yes even ive done it

33 id agree with but 36 in a 30

and yes its legal just pay it or go on the coarse

 

[Pigeon_Droppings2]

Can you do the safety course and avoid the points if this is a first offense maybe?

No idea if there's a way to avoid the fine...my view would be that I broke the rules so I'd just have to suck it up I reckon.

 

[rtcosic]

...
As a first offence and not too extreme you should be offered a speed awareness course. Take this if offered as it does not count as speeding offence conviction and usually does not affect your insurance. Do not mention it to your insurance company unless they specifically mention speed awareness course.
....

Be careful with that 'advice'.

Legally, attending a course is not a conviction and UK Road Offender Education (UKROEd), which manages the courses on behalf of the police, claims that data will not be shared with insurance companies and that they have no access to it.

However, if your insurer specifically asks about attending a speed awareness course you must answer fully and honestly. This falls under the 'utmost good faith' basis of insurance contracts and falls under the 'any other relevant information' clause.

Check the small print of your policy carefully.

It’s also worth carefully looking at any policy renewal requirement. If you have any doubts it’s best to check with your insurer.

It has been many years since I got caught out in similar circumstances. I checked with my insurer and was assured that they don't load your premium for one speeding offence carrying only a 3 point penalty. This seems to be fairly standard.

Bear in mind you are charged an extortionate fee for these courses which are delivered by an independent commercial provider. Check the cost of the course versus the fine and court fees.

Balancing all the costs I'd take the points if the extra cost is less than £100.

 

[Pete.]

The cops cannot share data about your speed awareness course due to data protection legislation so if you don't tell your insurer then no-one will. Don't tell one and not the other though just keep schtum if you're going to.

As for the OP the only way you can appeal that ticket without paying for expert help is if the NIP is sent so late that it turned up later that 14 days after the offence. If that happens then the NIP is unenforceable.

 

[brightspark]

Can you do the safety course and avoid the points if this is a first offense maybe?

No idea if there's a way to avoid the fine...my view would be that I broke the rules so I'd just have to suck it up I reckon.

i did the course for speeding doing 68 mph on the dual carriageway in my pug box van , was doing 60mph then went over a hill and i was yacking to my mate and the speed crept up going down tother side they certainly know where to position them , they can clock you from a mile away ..80 quid and no points or 100 quid and 3 points not doing the course. if its over 3 years since you last had one you can do one again, just learn from it and suck it up , dont do it again

 

[hotponyshoes]

Be careful with that 'advice'.

Legally, attending a course is not a conviction and UK Road Offender Education (UKROEd), which manages the courses on behalf of the police, claims that data will not be shared with insurance companies and that they have no access to it.

However, if your insurer specifically asks about attending a speed awareness course you must answer fully and honestly. This falls under the 'utmost good faith' basis of insurance contracts and falls under the 'any other relevant information' clause.

Check the small print of your policy carefully.

It’s also worth carefully looking at any policy renewal requirement. If you have any doubts it’s best to check with your insurer.

It has been many years since I got caught out in similar circumstances. I checked with my insurer and was assured that they don't load your premium for one speeding offence carrying only a 3 point penalty. This seems to be fairly standard.

Bear in mind you are charged an extortionate fee for these courses which are delivered by an independent commercial provider. Check the cost of the course versus the fine and court fees.

Balancing all the costs I'd take the points if the extra cost is less than £100.

Most insurers won't up the premium much (if at all) for 3 points.
6 points is a hearty increase though (amhik)

Last couple of awareness courses I have done have been about the same price as the fine, one slightly less, one slightly more.

If you get offered the chance of the course I think it would be nuts not to take it even at twice the price.
If you just take the 3 points what happens if you get caught again and not offered the course the 2nd time?
The insurers may not be able to see if you have done the course but they can certainly see if you have points on your licence...


I didn't actually think the cost of the course was extortionate, venue hire, 2 professional guys wages, admin paperwork.

Plus it's worth the fee just to listen to all the 70yr olds there moaning about how they had never been caught before..

The first course I ever did was just some little Aldof's telling us we were all basically child murders. They have mellowed down a lot over the years. The last one I did was heading towards a therapy session about ways to remove the stress that would cause us to speed in the first place.
Fairly informative and fairly relaxed. I did get pulled aside and told off for making a joke and disruption, but even then, the guys handled it very professionally.

I've learnt something every time so it counts towards my cpd record as well. A ban from too many points could see me up on a professional misconduct charge..

 

[ajlelectronics]

The first course I ever did was just some little Aldof's telling us we were all basically child murders.

My unspoken comment was "Why if the speed limits are so accurately decided and 1MPH makes all the difference, do we not see 24MPH, 33.5 MPH 53MPH etc?".

 

[brightspark]

M

Plus it's worth the fee just to listen to all the 70yr olds there moaning about how they had never been caught before..

what i say to them is when they say they never had an accident in all that time .they drive that slow and dont ever look in the mirror and see the long tailbacks and the carnage they have caused or they pull out of a side road and drive away merrily when some poor git had to brake like hell and swerve in to a ditch to miss them i just kept my gob shut and let him get on with it doing my course. i didnt even fill the form in on my action plan

 

[Robotstar5]

My unspoken comment was "Why if the speed limits are so accurately decided and 1MPH makes all the difference, do we not see 24MPH, 33.5 MPH 53MPH etc?".

I follow a round the world biker on Youtube, in the UAE one of the roads had posted speed limits of 160 kph!

 

[Morrisman]

I’ve done two speed awareness courses. First was in a classroom, 8 hours of somewhat repetitious tedium. The instructor spent the whole 8 hours gearing up for his party piece: “See kiddies, speeding doesn’t get you where you are going any faster”

To which I pointed out that most people speed because they like going fast, not because they are in a hurry.

Which didn’t impress him, and he reminded/threatened me that it is possible to fail the course…

And someone then asked why the cops and ambulances tear around at high speed, if it doesn’t get them there any faster.

Second course was done online, 3 hours by Zoom, not too bad.

 

[Pigeon_Droppings2]

I've learnt something every time so it counts towards my cpd record as well.

I'm struggling to think what profession it is that allows you to claim time spent at a speed awareness course as relevant learning .

 

[cheb]

I'm struggling to think what profession it is that allows you to claim time spent at a speed awareness course as relevant learning .

Funeral director.

 

[arther dailey]

Most insurers won't up the premium much (if at all) for 3 points.
6 points is a hearty increase though (amhik)

Last couple of awareness courses I have done have been about the same price as the fine, one slightly less, one slightly more.

If you get offered the chance of the course I think it would be nuts not to take it even at twice the price.
If you just take the 3 points what happens if you get caught again and not offered the course the 2nd time?
The insurers may not be able to see if you have done the course but they can certainly see if you have points on your licence...


I didn't actually think the cost of the course was extortionate, venue hire, 2 professional guys wages, admin paperwork.

Plus it's worth the fee just to listen to all the 70yr olds there moaning about how they had never been caught before..

The first course I ever did was just some little Aldof's telling us we were all basically child murders. They have mellowed down a lot over the years. The last one I did was heading towards a therapy session about ways to remove the stress that would cause us to speed in the first place.
Fairly informative and fairly relaxed. I did get pulled aside and told off for making a joke and disruption, but even then, the guys handled it very professionally.

I've learnt something every time so it counts towards my cpd record as well. A ban from too many points could see me up on a professional misconduct charge..

I for one at 70 never been in any trouble ever of any sort ,well not caught for it lets say, so that would be me , but I am not winging about it , I was speeding and thats that , was a crafty spot to put it though around a corner approaching the 40 limit up a slight hill so just about everyone starts to speed up, which of course does nt make it right or justifyable , just tough *** . My only gripe really is I thought I was under the limit as the person put their thumbs up , as if I was ok, bit off really but maybes they have a wicked sence of humour , who knows eh, but if this is the worst that happens to me this year hey ho what a good year I am going to have.