found this in the lathe paperwork

[BrokenBiker]

thought the forum may appreciate...tool prices from an undetermined year

 

[Erie Fred]

Interesting. I have never seen lathe tools that are flash butt welded HSS onto plain shanks before.
Seeing how drill shanks are made that way, it is a natural progression, why they never caught
on around here is a mystery.

 

[Agroshield]

You should keep that and wave it around when people insist it is OK to grind HSS and then plunge into water to cool. If they persist, send them a framed copy.

 

[Martin-Sy]

Ohh, thanks. I still use quite a few of those. Prices in £sd takes me back to growing up in an 'Arkwrights' shop.
I often feel that HSS lathe tools are overlooked in favour of carbide.
Each has it's place but I love the ease with which you can bring the edge back on HSS with a few stokes of a slip stone.

 

[RichardM]

I think the quenching is more for the fact that Stag are braized to the shank and quenching stresses the braided area.

 

[Martin Hocking]

Interesting. I have never seen lathe tools that are flash butt welded HSS onto plain shanks before.
Seeing how drill shanks are made that way, it is a natural progression, why they never caught
on around here is a mystery.

Interesting Fred, I always thought drills were all hss but the shank left soft. Every day’s a school day…

I’m pretty sure that welded tool shanks were legislated for as rationing style measure during WW2. So over a certain shank size full blanks were banned.

I think I remember seeing it mentioned in one of my grandads books of workshop standards.

I’m also pretty sure that at least half of the forum population is old enough to remember the war so I’m sure someone will be along soon to say whether I’ve just made that up!

 

[Martin Hocking]

Right so I’ve gone and had a look and it’s not quite as clear as I remember it being about the mandatory use of butt welded blanks. However from what’s written it would appear procuring full hss blanks in bigger sizes would have been very difficult in 1943 when the workshop standards books I have were first published…


From the older blue one:

Referring to the increasing importance of saving high speed steel…


And this in the beige one from 1953:
Referring to a war emergency standard



I’m sure I’ve seen it written more expressly that over a certain shank size it’s butt welded only.

Anyway that’s all I have for now…

 

[Jelly_Sheffield]

You should keep that and wave it around when people insist it is OK to grind HSS and then plunge into water to cool. If they persist, send them a framed copy.

Tool steel has moved on quite a bit with time, especially when we transitioned from T to M grades.

A phase change diagram for M42 which is the defacto standard these days, doesn't even begin it's first phase change until around 1000°C (orange hot).

The phase change which would result in meaningful crystal dislocations that could cause cracking if cooled rapidly is at about 1300°C (yellow-white hot)...

If you're grinding it that hard and holding it in your hand, you have bigger problems than the tool cracking, and you fully deserve them for your lack of mechanical sympathy!!!