Digital IDs

[stuvy]

China?

We ordered some titanium for work

It was so lightweight

I said to the boss is it chitanium, he told me some people would be offended with that…

 

[Prajna]

Perhaps, rather than be concerned about 'conspiracy theories' (the term originated with the CIA in the 1960s to denigrate those who objected to the 'official' lone gunman story of the JFK assasination), people would do better to study a bit of thoroughly documented history. I would suggest to begin by reading about the Tavistock Institute, funded and founded by the royal family, Rothchild and Rockerfellers in 1933 in order to swing public opinion in favour of war against Germany.

Once you are familiar with that history then you might examine the opinions you hold and evaluate what proportion of those were formed through the manipulations of the Tavistock Institute and its offshoots.

 

[CornishPete]

But planes were flying in and out unchecked weeks, months, after the initial 'lockdown'. A mate of mine flew into the UK, from China, mid lockdown, with absolutely no health checks or test or mask, only a printed handout waffling about 'if you have a fever' or some such drivel.

Same guy flew to Spain and back a couple of times over the following months, again, NO health or PPE on the plane or in the airport.

Too little, too late, when it did come, as all those in power were busy making a killing on crony contracts to focus on the finer details of their 'covid' safety policies.

This highlights and just strengthens my belief that all the things we are discussing aren't done solely for the good of the public. I realise there'll always be isolated incidents within any system but some of the things that happened were farcical. I also believe the reasons given for various measures (previously covid but currently I'm thinking particularly net zero and climate change here) aren't exactly genuine, as it all seems to be about money!! You can drive any car, if you pay, fly anywhere, if you pay, use as much plastic, if you pay etc...! Due to past and current contradiction by those in charge I simply don't believe them when they claim something is an "emergency" or "crisis". How does the air quality improve if I pay £12.50 for the same journey that was free last month? .

 

[rcx132]

Perhaps, rather than be concerned about 'conspiracy theories' (the term originated with the CIA in the 1960s to denigrate those who objected to the 'official' lone gunman story of the JFK assasination), people would do better to study a bit of thoroughly documented history. I would suggest to begin by reading about the Tavistock Institute, funded and founded by the royal family, Rothchild and Rockerfellers in 1933 in order to swing public opinion in favour of war against Germany.

Once you are familiar with that history then you might examine the opinions you hold and evaluate what proportion of those were formed through the manipulations of the Tavistock Institute and its offshoots.

I read Bad Science, a book that explained what it means to test an idea, why not all studies are equal, and the importance of there being a body of evidence. I stopped reading media sources that don't do well on reliability indexes. There's also an area of science that looks at how our minds deceive us, ie why we're prone to bias, and also explains things like why we can fall for a silly theory if it has a good narrative behind it. And generally subscribed to more academic sources such as the Economics enthusiasts subs, and same for history.

 

[Prajna]

This is politics. There is nothing we can do about it on a welding forum and you'll just upset other members who watch the BBC. And no Covid please. I'm trying to get out of the madness caused by a year not talking to anyone.

Sure this is a welding forum and not some arena where we can change the world, @malcolm, but it is also a collection of friends (I hope) and many of us care about the confusion we feel in this crazy world that seems to be getting crazier every day. One thing we can attempt to do, even if it verges on the political, is to assure our friends that they are not alone in their confusion and disgust at the state of things. I must say that I am relieved to find others who have not fallen for the Tavistock social programming and remain cynical of government by psychopaths, criminals and liers. I ignore threads that don't interest me and read those that do. Politics in a welding/engineering thread are fair game for censure but I feel that such threads as this are valuable too.

 

[pedrobedro]

currently I'm thinking particularly net zero and climate change here) aren't exactly genuine, as it all seems to be about money!!

Of course it's about money, how does paying to go into a city with your car make it alright when it's still chucking the same amount of gas out the back ? Do they spend the money on making the air cleaner ?

 

[rcx132]

Of course it's about money, how does paying to go into a city with your car make it alright when it's still chucking the same amount of gas out the back ? Do they spend the money on making the air cleaner ?

Or the fee is to give people a buffer, for example people who infrequently drive into the city and don't cause much pollution anyway, can keep their old car. The system has successfully got people to buy lower polluting cars.

It's also difficult to get something like ULEZ through government, a change like that needs a strong business case, it needs to align to government policies, it needs backing from multiple sources, including academic sources, it goes through countless reviews. It's difficult to "conspiricise" something like that, just the sheer number of people involved in getting a policy like that through means someone will whistleblow if there's a conspiracy.

 

[stuvy]

Perhaps, rather than be concerned about 'conspiracy theories' (the term originated with the CIA in the 1960s to denigrate those who objected to the 'official' lone gunman story of the JFK assasination), people would do better to study a bit of thoroughly documented history. I would suggest to begin by reading about the Tavistock Institute, funded and founded by the royal family, Rothchild and Rockerfellers in 1933 in order to swing public opinion in favour of war against Germany.

Once you are familiar with that history then you might examine the opinions you hold and evaluate what proportion of those were formed through the manipulations of the Tavistock Institute and its offshoots.

I read this at school

All been an anti royalist since

 

[reb78]

Or the fee is to give people a buffer, for example people who infrequently drive into the city and don't cause much pollution anyway, can keep their old car. The system has successfully got people to buy lower polluting cars.

It's also difficult to get something like ULEZ through government, a change like that needs a strong business case, it needs to align to government policies, it needs backing from multiple sources, including academic sources, it goes through countless reviews. It's difficult to "conspiricise" something like that, just the sheer number of people involved in getting a policy like that through means someone will whistleblow if there's a conspiracy.

Its been brought in without a single thought for less well off people who live in the areas. I have family in the zone - never had much money, shifted from pillar to post as their old housing was demolished in favour of 'better' housing they couldn't afford... large family, cant afford to move out of the area, cant afford a new car that is ULEZ compliant. They are screwed as they also cant afford £12.50 a day to simply own the car that gets them to work.... buses arent the answer unless you want to spend your life travelling to earn a living. None of my cars are compliant so its ten times harder to go and see them now. All that will happen is the greater London suburbs will become a playground for richer people as the locals are forced out.

 

[rcx132]

Perhaps, rather than be concerned about 'conspiracy theories' (the term originated with the CIA in the 1960s to denigrate those who objected to the 'official' lone gunman story of the JFK assasination), people would do better to study a bit of thoroughly documented history. I would suggest to begin by reading about the Tavistock Institute, funded and founded by the royal family, Rothchild and Rockerfellers in 1933 in order to swing public opinion in favour of war against Germany.

Once you are familiar with that history then you might examine the opinions you hold and evaluate what proportion of those were formed through the manipulations of the Tavistock Institute and its offshoots.

The Tavistock theory is a new one to me. So over to Scholar search to see if there's any academic source on this. I can't see any.

So over to Google just to have somewhere to start searching from. I see a book on the subject, the library has classified it under "conspiracy theories". Google immediately tells me that people who search for Tavistock conspiracy also search for other conspiracies such as the rockefeller conspiracy.

Another shortcut I use is to check why the editors at Wikipedia decided not to include the Tavistock conspiracy in their web page. You can see their discussion on their talk page. Some of it is complex, they evaluate whether Tavistock personnel had enough influence, and continuity throughout history, but one simple crunch line is that the whole conspiracy originated from a single self published book.

 

[stuvy]

The Tavistock theory is a new one to me. So over to Scholar search to see if there's any academic source on this. I can't see any.

So over to Google just to have somewhere to start searching from. I see a book on the subject, the library has classified it under "conspiracy theories". Google immediately tells me that people who search for Tavistock conspiracy also search for other conspiracies such as the rockefeller conspiracy.

Another shortcut I use is to check why the editors at Wikipedia decided not to include the Tavistock conspiracy in their web page. You can see their discussion on their talk page. Some of it is complex, they evaluate whether Tavistock personnel had enough influence, and continuity throughout history, but one simple crunch line is that the whole conspiracy originated from a single self published book.

Have you read up on the Rothschilds?

 

[Prajna]

The Tavistock theory is a new one to me. So over to Scholar search to see if there's any academic source on this. I can't see any.

So over to Google just to have somewhere to start searching from. I see a book on the subject, the library has classified it under "conspiracy theories". Google immediately tells me that people who search for Tavistock conspiracy also search for other conspiracies such as the rockefeller conspiracy.

Another shortcut I use is to check why the editors at Wikipedia decided not to include the Tavistock conspiracy in their web page. You can see their discussion on their talk page. Some of it is complex, they evaluate whether Tavistock personnel had enough influence, and continuity throughout history, but one simple crunch line is that the whole conspiracy originated from a single self published book.

Yes, sadly, if you rely on google ranking, wikipedia etc you will not see much of the picture. However, you can easily track down books by those who were/are involved with the Tavistock Institute, chief amongst whom is Edward Berneys, the nephew of Freud. Two of his notable works are Propaganda and Crystalising Opinion. So you can judge for yourself what was/is the intended purpose and even the methods used to achieve it. Perhaps even a cursory look at the wiki pages for Berneys, Margaret Mead and co will give you a more accurate idea than your normal debunking sources (which are certainly inspired and controlled by the very organisation you are investigating). I do hope you'll look a bit deeper and check out what those involved with the organisation have to say for themselves even if you disregard what John Coleman had to say about it. That wikipedia is so coy about the subject is astonishing since the Tavistock Institute created the OSS during the war, which later became the CIA. Such an historical event seems to me to be too notable to write off as conspiracy theory.

 

[Prajna]

Thanks for the reply, by the way, @rcx132. I'm very pleased that the discussion continues in a respectful and adult manner.

 

[rcx132]

Thanks for the reply, by the way, @rcx132. I'm very pleased that the discussion continues in a respectful and adult manner.

Thank you, I'm trying to be specific with examples and open to discussion. I agree that Wikipedia has issues, it has an academic bias, a left lean bias, and by their own admission, they are a tertiary source (i.e they regurgitate what the media and other sources say). The methods I listed are crude methods of trying to look up if something is true, I only use them to save time I'll look up some of the names you've listed after work.

Its been brought in without a single thought for less well off people who live in the areas. I have family in the zone - never had much money, shifted from pillar to post as their old housing was demolished in favour of 'better' housing they couldn't afford... large family, cant afford to move out of the area, cant afford a new car that is ULEZ compliant. They are screwed as they also cant afford £12.50 a day to simply own the car that gets them to work.... buses arent the answer unless you want to spend your life travelling to earn a living. None of my cars are compliant so its ten times harder to go and see them now. All that will happen is the greater London suburbs will become a playground for richer people as the locals are forced out.

I remember my geography teacher saying the same, that these types of policies affect the poorest the most and increase economic divides

 

[Cato]

The issue I have with enlightenment, conspiracy theories, knowledge of plots and cabals etc is what that knowledge brings or can be used for? As far as I can see all that anyone likely gains from it would be increased stress levels. King Canute springs to mind.

 

[My Old Landy]

The issue I have with enlightenment, conspiracy theories, knowledge of plots and cabals etc is what that knowledge brings or can be used for? As far as I can see all that anyone likely gains from it would be increased stress levels. King Canute springs to mind.

I agree that it creates a certain amount of paranoia, still just because you are paranoid it doesn't mean they are not out to get you.....

 

[Cato]

I agree that it creates a certain amount of paranoia, still just because you are paranoid it doesn't mean they are not out to get you.....

I'm not saying that any or all of the conspiracy theories are wrong, or denying the existence of cabals etc. at least in part because there isn't any conclusive evidence easily available one way or the other. My point/question was more about working on the premise that the theory is correct, what use is that knowledge?

 

[Prajna]

The issue I have with enlightenment, conspiracy theories, knowledge of plots and cabals etc is what that knowledge brings or can be used for? As far as I can see all that anyone likely gains from it would be increased stress levels. King Canute springs to mind.

For a start it means you would be more likely to be cynical of such wonderous new technologies as digital IDs and CBDCs. It means you are more likely to be able to evaluate news stories in an intelligent way. I am far more at ease in this mad world knowing who the 'bad guys' are and what they are up to than I was when I had no idea and was simply battered around by the unfairness of it all. I now have some agency and ability to make sensible choices, my health has improved immeasurably and my peace of mind is vastly improved, even though this seems paradoxical. They say that ignorance is bliss but your mind will always want to understand and is powerless to do so when you are ignorant or deceived.

 

[My Old Landy]

I'm not saying that any or all of the conspiracy theories are wrong, or denying the existence of cabals etc. at least in part because there isn't any conclusive evidence easily available one way or the other. My point/question was more about working on the premise that the theory is correct, what use is that knowledge?

I was being flippant I do agree that the knowledge doesn't help unless it brings down something that is bad. I sit on the side lines and watch each side amusingly calling each other names for the beliefs they hold on such things.

 

[My Old Landy]

For a start it means you would be more likely to be cynical of such wonderous new technologies as digital IDs and CBDCs. It means you are more likely to be able to evaluate news stories in an intelligent way. I am far more at ease in this mad world knowing who the 'bad guys' are and what they are up to than I was when I had no idea and was simply battered around by the unfairness of it all. I now have some agency and ability to make sensible choices, my health has improved immeasurably and my peace of mind is vastly improved, even though this seems paradoxical. They say that ignorance is bliss but your mind will always want to understand and is powerless to do so when you are ignorant or deceived.

I think that everyone should pursue whatever makes them be free in their mind. I personally do not give a jot. I have less time left than I have lived and worrying about such things has never helped me sleep. I also don't point fingers at those who don't think as I do, I just really do not concern myself with their beliefs.