Klopp shaper

[Tinbasherdan]

Hi guys, I’ve acquired a Klopp shaper from @northwest . It needs a bit of a refurb but I’ve not been able to find any sort of info regarding this model at all, does anyone know anything about them? (Pictures crap but it’s all I have!)

 

[Fastdruid]

I presume you have already looked here? http://lathes.co.uk/klopp/

 

[Tinbasherdan]

Yeah that was my first port of call

 

[Fastdruid]

It looks like the model 300

has anybody information on klopp 300 shaper?

Hello everyone, yesterday i got a german klopp 300 metal shaper. It is in pretty good condition but the motor isnt running and i do not know much about shapers. Does anybody have documents, plans or a manual for this german klopp 300 shaper? On pm i found an older thread where a member wrote...

www.practicalmachinist.com

 

[Tinbasherdan]

It looks similar but the foot is cast in on that one, whereas mine sits on two cast iron legs

 

[Tinbasherdan]

Perhaps could be an older model 300

 

[Fastdruid]

lathes.co.uk does say that the model number refers to the stroke so very likely still a "model 300" just an older one.

 

[northwest]

It is the 300, in an awful colour.

 

[Tinbasherdan]

It is the 300, in an awful colour.

I don’t know, “corporation yellow” is growing on me

 

[ronan]

You will have to do a thread on getting it back together and running.

 

[Tinbasherdan]

You will have to do a thread on getting it back together and running.

I intend to, waiting on moving soemwhere with a workshop I might actually be able to get into. Hopefully in the next month or two

 

[Turbo]

I clicked on this thinking it was about Jurgen's personal trainer.

 

[Agroshield]

Have a look on the 'usinages' forum as they have a lot of European stuff (or should that be machines of puppy dog origin?).

Look on YT as I have seen a good few there.

Learn the German for 'shaper'. and search using Klopp and that term.

 

[Tinbasherdan]

Having done a bit of digging on the scant information available, it would appear it’s in fact an early 30s klopp 250 shaper. Cannot find any information regarding motor speed though

 

[Fastdruid]

Cannot find any information regarding motor speed though

I'd imagine that is fairly straightforward to calculate though. Work out the strokes per revolution of the input at its slowest setting (or fastest if that is easier), cross reference against either the speed plate or specs and work backwards.

I presume yours is a flat belt type in which case just pick a suitable motor, pick a drive pulley that is suitably sized to hit the correct speed from the motor you pick (personally I'd probably use a 4 pole/~1400rpm motor) and you're sorted.

Oh and "Stossmaschine", "Stosshobler" and "Hobel" are the terms apparently to search for.

 

[Tinbasherdan]

I'd imagine that is fairly straightforward to calculate though. Work out the strokes per revolution of the input at its slowest setting (or fastest if that is easier), cross reference against either the speed plate or specs and work backwards.

I presume yours is a flat belt type in which case just pick a suitable motor, pick a drive pulley that is suitably sized to hit the correct speed from the motor you pick (personally I'd probably use a 4 pole/~1400rpm motor) and you're sorted.

Oh and "Stossmaschine", "Stosshobler" and "Hobel" are the terms apparently to search for.

I can’t find any specs for speed, and there’s no plate on the machine

 

[Fastdruid]

I can’t find any specs for speed, and there’s no plate on the machine

There _should_ I think be a chart because how else are you meant to get things at the right "surface" speed (and because the surface speed is a function of both rpm and stroke length it's not simple).

This is a 350 but shows the kind of thing I mean. That black chart pretty much in the centre of the image.

Could ask some of the youtubers who feature them.

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCkhexJOUQmGU0lCywBpXIQg/videos

https://www.youtube.com/user/Obdus24/videos

https://www.youtube.com/user/sanderelo1/videos

Failing that you could guestimate, I doubt it would be much different from the 300 and lathes.co.uk has this to say of them: "Smallest of the shapers made from the 1950s onwards was the 1 h.p. Model 300 weighing 1100 lbs and having a 300 mm (11.8") ram stroke with four double-stroke-per-minute speeds that ranged from 30-200"

 

[Tinbasherdan]

There _should_ I think be a chart because how else are you meant to get things at the right "surface" speed (and because the surface speed is a function of both rpm and stroke length it's not simple).

This is a 350 but shows the kind of thing I mean. That black chart pretty much in the centre of the image.

Could ask some of the youtubers who feature them.

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCkhexJOUQmGU0lCywBpXIQg/videos

https://www.youtube.com/user/Obdus24/videos

https://www.youtube.com/user/sanderelo1/videos

Failing that you could guestimate, I doubt it would be much different from the 300 and lathes.co.uk has this to say of them: "Smallest of the shapers made from the 1950s onwards was the 1 h.p. Model 300 weighing 1100 lbs and having a 300 mm (11.8") ram stroke with four double-stroke-per-minute speeds that ranged from 30-200"

That may be a good start, it’s only a two speed machine as far as I can gather unless I’m missing something. I did consider contacting folk on YouTube but I think the most recent poster last posted 4 years ago

 

[Fastdruid]

I did consider contacting folk on YouTube but I think the most recent poster last posted 4 years ago

To be utterly honest I wouldn't really give much worry about that. My last facebook public video was 2 years ago and before that the previous was 6 years ago....but that's just the public ones, my private videos the last one was 6 days ago and I'm on there enough to see anything anyone posts.

It's worth asking anyway!

 

[Agroshield]

As he says above, put a 1400rpm motor on it and do not worry. You will never have a problem with a shaper of it going too slow. You would be foolish to set it to full stroke and full speed simultaneously.

Search for 'Klopp 250' here: https://forum.zerspanungsbude.net/portal

I think a lot of the threads are the same YT videos shown above, so contact via the forum might be easier than via YT.

As Fastdruid says,calculating speeds for a shaper are not as simple as a lathe. The one thing not mentioned above is that the forward stroke is slower than the back stroke (due to the Whitworth quick return mechanism). You have to factor that into the calculation as well. It is best to work from or to the bull gear rpm as that is directly geared to the motor. You then modify that rpm according to stroke length and forward/return ratio for actual cutting surface speed.

Another Klopp data plate that is more legible: