Damn Suzuki, why is the bleed nipple not at the top!

[rcx132]

Check out the wheel cylinder from my Vitara. The bleed hole is not at the top. Spongy brakes and endless bleeding couldn't get the brakes firm. Every part of the brake system has been replaced, inc master cylinder, but still spongy.

Then I find the bleed hole on the wheel cylinders is not at the top. So I bench bled the cylinders and sealed the holes with grease so the fluid stayed in while fitting. Almost worked, some fluid leaked out during fitting but brakes now acceptably firm but not like they should be.

The position of the bleed hole is the same on the OEM wheel cylinders as these Pagid brand ones.

I'll try to tilt the entire car as the obvious next things to try, but serious, can't think why Suzuki would do this. The factory manual just has the usual bleed instructions, nothing about how to deal with this problem.

 

[gavcarter]

Transit clutches are the same. Bleed nipple on top of slave cylinder at gearbox level. Master cylinder is above engine.

I use a big plastic syringe and fill from the nipple, doing best to catch fluid in a tub and with rags as it comes out of reservoir.

I did rear brakes the same but I had replaced most of the lines so system was empty and not that messy.

 

[nickk]

I had same problem on a Range Rover years ago, on the back axle couldn't fathom, then I saw it had 2 callipers of the same hand, just removed calliper & bled it right way up.bit more puzzling for your problem though, how about blanking it & refitting a new nipple at the top ?

 

[keithski122]

Peugeot rear calipers used to be the same, just unbolt caliper, block between pads and hold caliper so nipple at the top.

 

[500e]

Been there as keithski said remove push pistons back block bead re fit

 

[rtbcomp]

Landrover SIII LWB 2LS are the same. Pushing the pedal down quickly with the bleed screw open helps, the inrush of fluid scoops the air up and expels it.

 

[gordon stephenson]

I had trouble years ago with a vauxhall, Adjusted the bakes then bled countless times, still could not a decent pedal, Finally figured out the only way to remove all the air was to back off the adjusters to get the pistons to the bottom of the cylinders first, When the brakes were adjusted out, The piston was above the nipples,

 

[Ruffian]

Vacuum bleeder would draw fluid and air out faster and sometimes helps.

But would be going for the,
Tilting the car also to try and get the cylinder closer to the top.

 

[rcx132]

Landrover SIII LWB 2LS are the same. Pushing the pedal down quickly with the bleed screw open helps, the inrush of fluid scoops the air up and expels it.

I tried that. I fitted some Goodridge speed bleeders, these are nipples with a valve built in, so no possibility of air getting in. Leave them open and pump the pedal as fast as you want. But it didn't help.

I had trouble years ago with a vauxhall, Adjusted the bakes then bled countless times, still could not a decent pedal, Finally figured out the only way to remove all the air was to back off the adjusters to get the pistons to the bottom of the cylinders first, When the brakes were adjusted out, The piston was above the nipples,

Did this and it helped a lot. In my case the bleed hole is in the middle of the wheel cylinder so I pushed the pistons all the way in. That way the area to trap air was reduced. But there still 0.25 sq.cm of air trap even with the pistone all the way in.

 

[winchman]

I would try a pressure or vacuum bleeder, I feel the inrush of fluid will draw it out
I remember having trouble with a fiesta and I had to hold the jar of fluid higher than the cylinder no idea why but it worked.

 

[zzr1200]

There's a few ways to over come this problem.

1. Fill wheel cylinder with red rubber grease, then squeeze piston/pistons together to remove the air then bleed as normal.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/RUBBER-GRE...1518162400&sr=8-11&keywords=red+rubber+grease

2. Reposition the brake pipe so that it enters the cylinder at the bottom hole and fit the brake bleed nipple to the top hole, now bleed system. You may need to fit a new brake pipe to access the bottom hole.

3. Remove the back plate assembly.

Series LWB Land Rovers have 2 cylinders each side (at the top n bottom) the front brake cylinders bleed nipple is fitted to the bottom cylinder.

The only sure way I've found is to remove the complete brake back plate assembly including shoes from the axle, then place level them on the top the road spring and then bleed the brakes. A long winded way but it does work.

Vacuum and pressure bleeding systems are another way but are generally not cost effective for one off jobs.

 

[winchman]

Might be worth taking it to a garage and let them pressure bleed it
I have seen one made from an old inner tube and a bike pump.
£13?
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Hand-Hel...588584&hash=item25dc4aca8b:g:OlcAAOSwBRFaJRvP

 

[Ruffian]

If your local, (Devon somerset border)
You can borrow my pressure and or vacuum bleeder,

 

[wookie]

They probably draw a vacuum in the factory before adding the fluid so they don't need the nipple at the top, now I agree it's bad practice to not have the nipple at the top but stuff is designed so it's easy and cheap to build with sod-all consideration for anyone. I haven't worked in vehicle manufacturing for years but I know we had a machine that used to always draw a vacuum on the clutch before filling with a measured amount of fluid, it was entirely automatic apart from the operator fitting it to the master cylinder cap.

 

[zzr1200]

now I agree it's bad practice to not have the nipple at the top but stuff is designed so it's easy and cheap to build with sod-all consideration for anyone.

Totally agree even the manufacturers don't care about the main dealer mechanics, let alone the diy'er, its all down to cost, so the boys at the top can go on their "Jollies"...

 

[RonA]

Check out the wheel cylinder from my Vitara. The bleed hole is not at the top. Spongy brakes and endless bleeding couldn't get the brakes firm. Every part of the brake system has been replaced, inc master cylinder, but still spongy.

On some vehicles the pipe runs don’t lend themselves to easy bleeding. Try putting pressure (wedge it down) on the brake pedal overnight. Then rebleed in the morning. The pressure makes the air bubbles aglomorate & easier to remove.
A trick passed onto me by an old mechanic.
RonA