SIP Top Mig Turbo 150 - gasless?

[plook]

My Landy has just failed the MOT on some welding and i need to dig out my SIP Top Mig Turbo 150 but i don't have a gas contract anymore.

Can i use gasless wire on this model and if so, how do i do it, what's involved other than buying the gasless wire and a bigger nipple for it to feed through?

thanks

 

[grim_d]

The polarity on the torch will need swapped round also, I believe.

 

[keith19]

It's not built for gasless, is it?
You may have problems with the wire feed rollers; most small gas migs use an 0.6 mm groove one side of the roller, and 0.8 mm on the other.

Most gasless wire is 0.9 mm, and uses a knurled groove on the roller to grip the softer gasless wire. It might be an idea to obtain advice on using a roller from a SIP gasless, to see if it will fit the 150's wire feed motor drive shaft.

Tips for 0.9 mm gasless wire will need to be 1.0 mm.

Polarity as pointed out above, may be a problem, although I have read successful gasless welds can be made with the torch Positive, normal set-up for a mig gas welder; but it isn't regarded as technically correct. If you get that far with the rest of the set-up, give it a try, I don't believe it can harm the welder, just the welds.

If you go for it, let us know how you get on, it may help someone else, too.

 

[schnappi]

Go for it. I used 0.8mm SIP flux cored (gasless) wire in my SIP HandyMIG (gas only model) to replace a full sill on a 20 year old Astra last month and it worked fine.

Can't imagine your gas only SIP Turbo 150 would behave any differently to my gas only SIP HandyMIG when running flux cored.

FWIW, I bought the SIP branded 0.8mm flux cored wire from Halfords.

 

[plook]

I'll buy a roll of wire and see how it goes. Can you give me more info on the swapping the polarity around thing.

 

[plook]

I just got this mesage from SIP UK:

The machine cant be converted (to gasless) other than rewiring the complete machine. This would only be possible by a fully competent electrician who has a lot of time to spend on it.

Is he right or blowing smoke up the proverbial?

 

[Wozzaaah]

He's right in one respect as the machine is sold as a gas only machine.
Gasless welding runs DCEN (DC current, electrode negative) which means that the wire (electrode) runs negative polarity and the work return ('earth') runs positive. Welding with solid wire and shielding gas requires DCEP meaning the wire runs + and the work return runs -.
Dual-purpose machines (gas/gasless) utilise an easy method of polarity reversal, usually undoing a couple of hand nuts and swapping the cables. Your machine has no easy way to do it so yes, it would have to be dismantled.

 

[madkayaker]

it would have to be dismantled but with a decent understanding of welders and electricity it could be done as its only a case of swapping the output connections of the recityer

 

[schnappi]

I've done what it is you're trying to do. I've welded up a car with a SIP MIG using gasless wire with the incorrect polarity. My welder is gas only, I ignored that and used gasless wire. The polarity being incorrect caused me no problem whatsoever.

The welds penetrated well, they looked very neat (after wire brushing). I ground them down flush, during grinding the welds showed no signs of cavitation or porosity. The car went through the MOT and it passed without comment.

In short, stop worrying about the machine supposedly not being able to run the gasless wire. I've tried it and it works.

Perhaps if I was welding up a thick bit of metal on a JCB the polarity thing would matter, for car bodywork it didn't seem to matter at all. And besides, the worst that can happen is you waste £15 on a reel of gasless wire.

 

[Engineer]

That machine is really going to struggle if you need to replace any chassis parts. If its a one off job it might be worth hiring a proper professional MIG set, which would make the job a whole lot easier, and save a fair amount of time, and a lot of aggravation.