Sill Repair - flange sealing

[Alex Brown]

I've recently welded on a new sill section to my car. I plug welded along the seam and looking down from the yet to be completed inner wheel arch, so looking from above at the flanges I have plug welded it looks so susceptible to water getting in by capillary action. I did coat all the metal with weld through primer prior to welding

Obviously I will seam seal along the bottom (apart from the drain holes that are built as little kinks in the outer flange) but Ideally I'd like to seal the top too whilst i have some access as this car is prone to water getting into the sill cavities (hence the drain holes and the whole need for this work in the first place). i say "access" in that I can probably reach the first 100mm of the flange by hand from the arch, but there is about 700mm of newly welded sill I would like to access. I guess I could try some sort of cavity wax and a lance, or some very thin epoxy primer and some sort of tube to get it down there. The car is sloped forward currently so that would help it run down to the areas I can't access.

So... I guess I'm just asking for advice on products and/or techniques/ideas to prolong the life of this repair.

 

[the snooper]

I've recently welded on a new sill section to my car. I plug welded along the seam and looking down from the yet to be completed inner wheel arch, so looking from above at the flanges I have plug welded it looks so susceptible to water getting in by capillary action. I did coat all the metal with weld through primer prior to welding

Obviously I will seam seal along the bottom (apart from the drain holes that are built as little kinks in the outer flange) but Ideally I'd like to seal the top too whilst i have some access as this car is prone to water getting into the sill cavities (hence the drain holes and the whole need for this work in the first place). i say "access" in that I can probably reach the first 100mm of the flange by hand from the arch, but there is about 700mm of newly welded sill I would like to access. I guess I could try some sort of cavity wax and a lance, or some very thin epoxy primer and some sort of tube to get it down there. The car is sloped forward currently so that would help it run down to the areas I can't access.

So... I guess I'm just asking for advice on products and/or techniques/ideas to prolong the life of this repair.

Could put a paint brush on a stick at 90 degrees and paint in there using epoxy then cavity wax to be sure

 

[steveo3002]

yeah thats what id do ....paintbrush on a stick then a couple of squirts of cavity wax

 

[Chris Stevens]

I've recently welded on a new sill section to my car. I plug welded along the seam and looking down from the yet to be completed inner wheel arch, so looking from above at the flanges I have plug welded it looks so susceptible to water getting in by capillary action. I did coat all the metal with weld through primer prior to welding

Obviously I will seam seal along the bottom (apart from the drain holes that are built as little kinks in the outer flange) but Ideally I'd like to seal the top too whilst i have some access as this car is prone to water getting into the sill cavities (hence the drain holes and the whole need for this work in the first place). i say "access" in that I can probably reach the first 100mm of the flange by hand from the arch, but there is about 700mm of newly welded sill I would like to access. I guess I could try some sort of cavity wax and a lance, or some very thin epoxy primer and some sort of tube to get it down there. The car is sloped forward currently so that would help it run down to the areas I can't access.

So... I guess I'm just asking for advice on products and/or techniques/ideas to prolong the life of this repair.

If you have plug welded the top of the sill, it will fail MOT, unless you weld it continuously, or make it look like its been welded fully.

 

[Wozzaaah]

If you have plug welded the top of the sill, it will fail MOT, unless you weld it continuously, or make it look like its been welded fully.

Plug welds are acceptable where spot welds originally were as long as the correct procedure is followed.

 

[BChild]

Plug welds are acceptable where spot welds originally were as long as the correct procedure is followed.

Agreed - where a complete panel is used

But if just a section is used as a repair the even if the original was spot welded the repair section must be continuously welded

Right now with no pictures it's hard to tell what was required

 

[Chris Stevens]

Very few people go to the trouble of removing original spot welds, and fitting a full sill as original. If OP has fitted full panel as original than no problem at all, but if not worth looking at repair very carefully before taking for MOT.

 

[optima21]

my cars have both had the bottom half of the sills replaced, and the seam welds at the top havn't been fully ground down so you can see them. the bottoms of the sills have all been plug welded (where the originals were spot welded) and none of the MOT testers have mentioned that it is wrong, or given an advisory or a failure over the years since its been done.

 

[Chris Stevens]

Thats fine. If you fit a part panel and seam weld it to the original part, and plug weld where it was spot welded originally no problem at all. If you plug weld the top part, then it will fail MOT deffo, if the plugs can be seen.

 

[Alex Brown]

Here's what I've done... Once its all ground down, filled and painted the MOT tester isn't even gonna know it's been repaired so hopefully it will be fine

I haven't got a good photo to show the problem described in OP, I basically wanna seal the gap between the flanges, directly above the plug welds but accessing them from above is the problem. Because of the jacking point strengthening sections it will be difficult to make a rod and brush device... I'm going to have a go with a long 8mm tube, fillng it with epoxy primer and blowing down the tube to try and spread it down the length of the seam...

Another thought was to drill a number of holes in the new sill and inject some paint and/or cavity wax. then filling/welding them up.... not too keen on this idea obviously

 

[colnerov]

Hi, Use one of these, You can do primer first and wax after. If your worried about coverage inside then replace the flexible line with brake pipe. Push it in as far as needed and spray as you withdraw that way it doesn't get too covered in paint/wax and make a mess. -

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/UNDERBODY...-OIL-STONECHIP-SCHUTZ-SPRAY-GUN-/230974566850

Colin

 

[the snooper]

Agreed - where a complete panel is used

But if just a section is used as a repair the even if the original was spot welded the repair section must be continuously welded

Right now with no pictures it's hard to tell what was required

You can put a section in a sill and plug weld the lower seam as long as the upper 3 sides are seam welded I've done it countless times

 

[anjum]

Hi, Use one of these, You can do primer first and wax after. If your worried about coverage inside then replace the flexible line with brake pipe. Push it in as far as needed and spray as you withdraw that way it doesn't get too covered in paint/wax and make a mess. -

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/UNDERBODY...-OIL-STONECHIP-SCHUTZ-SPRAY-GUN-/230974566850

Colin

Thanks for the tip about using brake pipe!!

 

[Burdekin]

It is essential that repairs to corroded or damaged areas are properly carried out. This requires that suitable materials of appropriate gauge or thickness are used for repairs. Additionally:

· Any plating or welding extends to a sound part of a load bearing member.

· the repair must appear to be virtually as strong as the original structure with only continuous seam welding being acceptable for patch repairs (even if the patch extends beyond the prescribed area).

· spot welded joints are acceptable where the original panel has been replaced to an existing spot welded flange (provided the original defective panel flange has been removed). Stitch or plug welding is acceptable as an alternative to spot welding in these cases.

· MIG brazing, a combination of adhesive bonding and riveting, or amalgamations of these with other joining methods may be the vehicle manufacturers recommended method of repair. Such repairs must therefore be accepted unless they are clearly inadequate.

 

[waldershelf]

Here's what I've done... Once its all ground down, filled and painted the MOT tester isn't even gonna know it's been repaired so hopefully it will be fine

I haven't got a good photo to show the problem described in OP, I basically wanna seal the gap between the flanges, directly above the plug welds but accessing them from above is the problem. Because of the jacking point strengthening sections it will be difficult to make a rod and brush device... I'm going to have a go with a long 8mm tube, fillng it with epoxy primer and blowing down the tube to try and spread it down the length of the seam...

Another thought was to drill a number of holes in the new sill and inject some paint and/or cavity wax. then filling/welding them up.... not too keen on this idea obviously

I think you need to seam weld the top and left hand side (in the picture) to regain the structural integrity and pass the MOT. Grinding it down and skimming it with filler might fool the tester but I for one wouldn't be happy.

 

[the snooper]

I think you need to seam weld the top and left hand side (in the picture) to regain the structural integrity and pass the MOT. Grinding it down and skimming it with filler might fool the tester but I for one wouldn't be happy.

his picture does show he will seam weld it if you look closer