- Thread starter Piero
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madkayaker
Pro sparkey Pro Welder
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Add a flow meter onto it and jobs done
Piero
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thanks
but not meaning to sound rude, but I know that.
I was just wondering why we have LPM on some and bar on others.
As to adding a flow meter (which I have)
I dont really see it as right!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
when you have a flow meter on a regulator, the flow is adusted on the flow meter, you dont have adustment on the regulator.
now adding a flow meter to a regulator will add problems.
so say you set the regulator at 15 lpm, and start fine tuning the flow meter, if you need more lpm, you got to got back to the regulator and then the flow meter.
the two adustments just conflict with one and other, I dont see the advantages
but not meaning to sound rude, but I know that.
I was just wondering why we have LPM on some and bar on others.
As to adding a flow meter (which I have)
I dont really see it as right!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
when you have a flow meter on a regulator, the flow is adusted on the flow meter, you dont have adustment on the regulator.
now adding a flow meter to a regulator will add problems.
so say you set the regulator at 15 lpm, and start fine tuning the flow meter, if you need more lpm, you got to got back to the regulator and then the flow meter.
the two adustments just conflict with one and other, I dont see the advantages
madkayaker
Pro sparkey Pro Welder
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So you ask a question and then say you know the answer! There is many industrial uses for argon and other inert gasses where pressure is far more relevant than flow rate which is why there are two types of regulator.
backpurge
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As MK says there are many application where you would use a regulator that is marked in outlet pressure as opposed to flow, it is still perfectly OK to use for shielding gas.
Flowmeters tend to be fitted after the regulator as these usually give a more accurate reading than the gauges on a lot of regulators, and remember if the regulator is a single stage one the outlet pressure is going to increase as the cylinder empties so if you are really bothered about the accuracy of your flow rate you will need to keep turning the outlet flow down throughout the life of the cylinder anyway.
I personally wouldn't bother with a flowmeter for MAG welding but would always measure the flow at the end of the gas shroud, that way you get a more accurate reading.
Using a flowmeter at the regulator and also taking a reading at your gas shroud can be a useful indication if you suspect you have a leak in the system
Flowmeters tend to be fitted after the regulator as these usually give a more accurate reading than the gauges on a lot of regulators, and remember if the regulator is a single stage one the outlet pressure is going to increase as the cylinder empties so if you are really bothered about the accuracy of your flow rate you will need to keep turning the outlet flow down throughout the life of the cylinder anyway.
I personally wouldn't bother with a flowmeter for MAG welding but would always measure the flow at the end of the gas shroud, that way you get a more accurate reading.
Using a flowmeter at the regulator and also taking a reading at your gas shroud can be a useful indication if you suspect you have a leak in the system
Piero
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Thanks Backpurge
Food for thought as to single stage regulators and flow incress.
I do understand the need to a more acurate flow metter than a gauge,
but cant see why you would have the two,
also as said, you then have two flow controls, one on the regulator and one on the flow metter.
If you look at a regulator with a flow metter (from new) you tend to not have a regulator adustment, its only on the flow metter.
Food for thought as to single stage regulators and flow incress.
I do understand the need to a more acurate flow metter than a gauge,
but cant see why you would have the two,
also as said, you then have two flow controls, one on the regulator and one on the flow metter.
If you look at a regulator with a flow metter (from new) you tend to not have a regulator adustment, its only on the flow metter.
backpurge
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Most regulators that are MAG specific will come with a pressure adjustment screw on the front of the reg and the outlet gauge is marked in flow rather than pressure, the majority of regs with a built in flow tube and no pressure adjustment screw on the regulator body are designed for TIG, that's not to say you can't use them on MAG as well it's just a commonly accepted fact that accurate flows are more relevant to TIG than MAG
I saw on your original post you mentioned purging, flow rates are generally more critical for purging than shielding so you would definately need a flow meter than a pressure gauge for purging
I saw on your original post you mentioned purging, flow rates are generally more critical for purging than shielding so you would definately need a flow meter than a pressure gauge for purging
pedrobedro
Man at Matalan
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Bar is pressure, if a regulator only has one gauge it shows the cylinder pressure in bar or cubic feet. LPM or CFH are measurements of flow rate, are you sure the gauge is not just showing cylinder pressure ? It would have to read bar per hour or minute to show a useful measurement.
shenion
Tool Pack Rat
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No you only have one adjustment. You normally set the pressure to 30-50PSI then set the flow with the flowmeter.
That is what I have. I never have touched the regulator after setting it to 50 PSI.
The flow meter does not "fine tune" the flow, it sets it.
backpurge
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Some regulators will show the outlet reading in bar or psi, it just depends on what application the regulator is designed for, only a small proportion of regulators are used for welding applications
How many regulators have you been through now Piero? I get that this thread may be more curiousity than practical but i'm wondering (probably wrongly) if you're over thinking things?
As said the adjustment screw on 2 gauge regs adjusts pressure regardless of what's written on the gauge. Inside the reg the gas passes through a fixed size orifice so varying the pressure will vary the flow rate- the gauge can calibrated for either pressure or flow in kinda the same way that your cars fuel, water temp etc gauges are actually measuring a voltage despite the fact that they're displaying contents or temp etc
Flowmeters work like this... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thorpe_tube_flowmeter The way i'd use a flowmeter with an adjustable reg is to fully open the flowmeter and then open the reg until the flowmeter's showing near max before throttling the flowmeter back to set the rate i'm after. If you're purging from a single cylinder then just add a Y splitter to the regs outlet and fit your flowmeters to that. When purging set the welders flowrate with the purge running. If you don't want multiple flowmeters hanging off the reg for whatever reason then use an adjustable reg and get yourself a http://www.weldequip.com/gas-flow-tester.htm to check flow rates
With regards to purging unfortunately experience counts as much as a flowmeter (well, unless someone else is picking up the argon bill). For many hobby/automotive applications you can often get away with flowrates that barely register provided all the joints are taped up until you weld 'em. This is 2.25 or 2.5" tube...
once the purge was estabilished it was turned down until the float was just lifted off it's seat and a ways short of whatever the min resolution of the scale is
As said the adjustment screw on 2 gauge regs adjusts pressure regardless of what's written on the gauge. Inside the reg the gas passes through a fixed size orifice so varying the pressure will vary the flow rate- the gauge can calibrated for either pressure or flow in kinda the same way that your cars fuel, water temp etc gauges are actually measuring a voltage despite the fact that they're displaying contents or temp etc
Flowmeters work like this... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thorpe_tube_flowmeter The way i'd use a flowmeter with an adjustable reg is to fully open the flowmeter and then open the reg until the flowmeter's showing near max before throttling the flowmeter back to set the rate i'm after. If you're purging from a single cylinder then just add a Y splitter to the regs outlet and fit your flowmeters to that. When purging set the welders flowrate with the purge running. If you don't want multiple flowmeters hanging off the reg for whatever reason then use an adjustable reg and get yourself a http://www.weldequip.com/gas-flow-tester.htm to check flow rates
With regards to purging unfortunately experience counts as much as a flowmeter (well, unless someone else is picking up the argon bill). For many hobby/automotive applications you can often get away with flowrates that barely register provided all the joints are taped up until you weld 'em. This is 2.25 or 2.5" tube...
once the purge was estabilished it was turned down until the float was just lifted off it's seat and a ways short of whatever the min resolution of the scale is
Piero
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Hi guys
(Hotrodder) when I bought my set up, I asked for a argon saver.
My dealer sent me one togeather with a regulator.
The regulator used to give less gas the more you opened it.
So my dealer sent me a new reg.
The new reg done the same thing so he sent me a new gas saver and I sent him back the old gas saver.
Still had the same trouble.
When I put the saver on an old boc regulator, it was much better, but not 100%.
So the dealer desided to send an other regulator but this one read in bar.
I had had enough at this stage, so I advised him to send the gas saver that I returned back to gas arc who makes them.
Turns out it was the gas saver all along.
My dealer said not to bother sending back the regulators.
I sold one to cover my postage but now have the gas regulator that works in bar.
He did send me a flow meter to add to it.
But in the mean time, I bought a boc regulator of fleebay out of my own pocket, so now the bar reading regulator is a spare and I don't know what to do with it.
Hence I was asking what they are used for
(Hotrodder) when I bought my set up, I asked for a argon saver.
My dealer sent me one togeather with a regulator.
The regulator used to give less gas the more you opened it.
So my dealer sent me a new reg.
The new reg done the same thing so he sent me a new gas saver and I sent him back the old gas saver.
Still had the same trouble.
When I put the saver on an old boc regulator, it was much better, but not 100%.
So the dealer desided to send an other regulator but this one read in bar.
I had had enough at this stage, so I advised him to send the gas saver that I returned back to gas arc who makes them.
Turns out it was the gas saver all along.
My dealer said not to bother sending back the regulators.
I sold one to cover my postage but now have the gas regulator that works in bar.
He did send me a flow meter to add to it.
But in the mean time, I bought a boc regulator of fleebay out of my own pocket, so now the bar reading regulator is a spare and I don't know what to do with it.
Hence I was asking what they are used for
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pedrobedro
Man at Matalan
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Regulators work the opposite way to something like a valve or water tap. Don't be offended if I ask but you are screwing the big knob on the front in clockwise to increase pressure aren't you ? Fully out anti clockwise will stop flow completely.
Piero
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No offence taken. HONESTLY
But yes, I know what I am doing.
I have been mig weling for years.
As I said, both gas savers were sent back and tested and found to be faulty.
funny enough, the new gas saver they sent me was a little differant from both the older ones, I am guessing they are differant for a reason!!!!!!!!!!!
as to offending me, I am just inqizzative, I like to ask questions, cross examine what has been said,
thats just the way I am.
I sit behind my keyboad smilling most of the time,
People just missread me,
But yes, I know what I am doing.
I have been mig weling for years.
As I said, both gas savers were sent back and tested and found to be faulty.
funny enough, the new gas saver they sent me was a little differant from both the older ones, I am guessing they are differant for a reason!!!!!!!!!!!
as to offending me, I am just inqizzative, I like to ask questions, cross examine what has been said,
thats just the way I am.
I sit behind my keyboad smilling most of the time,
People just missread me,
I could give it a home !
Dave
Edit:
Just seen the item in the for sale section - is that the one your sold or the one with the output in bar I quoted above?
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