Oscilloscope/ignition deciphering

[cardiffrob]

I've been given an old Oscilloscope that has been used for ignition fault finding. There is no paperwork with it so I haven't really got much of a clue what it is able to tell me. Does anyone have a link to somewhere that can educate me on the deciphering of the display, other than what Google brings? It's to be used on 1950s cars.

Thanks

Rob

 

[rikrobson]

all it can really do is show the voltage and time of the ignition. You should be able to set the trigger point of the cycle and then the x axis will relate to the timing and dewll. the Y axis will be strength of the spark.
Is there a lead or leads to connect to the HT lines and maybe something to connect to the points?
The curve should be able to show the spark generation at the points.

 

[armalites]

Have a look at scanner danner on youtube, mostly modern vehicles but gives some good insight on using oscilliscopes

 

[rtbcomp]

A photo of the controls would help.

 

[cardiffrob]

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Nice-Used...D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557

This is an identical unit. Heathkit co-1015. It's another of those "If I don't learn to use it then another skill will be lost to history" sort of things. All the bits are there but no instructional info.

 

[MrFluffy]

Thats a kit built machine originally, heathkit were famous for supplying really really good quality electronics kits and would fix them if you built them and they wouldnt work and the manual and docs were excellent as a result. I've got a old souraru diagnostics centre but its not got a scope on it so I use a normal oscilloscope along side it when working on older stuff & I did basic sun diagnostics with a inbuilt scope at tech college too. So basically you use the scope to see the shape of things to make sure theyre healthy. See the ignition pulse shape to make sure the coil is working in good order etc.
You should have a probe to clip on a ht lead and a lead with it to clip the coil. Its a 10:1 probe if you need to source another. If it doesnt work at all, it'll be a electronics fun job repairing it but not cost effective.
I like the normal scope I have a bit more because I can use it to see reluctor pulses and because I have a dual channel compare phases on 3 phase alternators and stuff, but I'm fairly into electronics in general.

Theres a schematic for it here :-
http://www.vintage-radio.info/download.php?id=537

Chap here has the manual for sale for $20, put 1015 into the search
https://sc2.vom.com/d8/index.fwx?C=MANUALS


A google round pops up the following on heathkits :-
http://www.corvetteforum.com/forums/c1-and-c2-corvettes/2719909-heathkit-ignition-analyzer.html

This is a model CO1015 ignition analyzer. It is basically an oscilloscope set for auto ignitions. It consists of the scope and the inductive cable setup. You attache one inductive pickup to spark plug lead number 1 and one to the coil wire. You also have a ground and a lead to the primary wire on the coil. This machine works with HEI and MSDS type ignitions as well as standard point types.

It will display a parade of the plugs firing. You can compare the trace of each plug to the others and easily see if any are misfiring. It will also display the coil pulse out put and engine rpm. The unit originally came with two manuals, an assembly manual and an operation manual. You really want the assembly manual because it has more info and more pictures. There are many photos do different traces showing what to look for.

The key to buying one of these is the condition. Some of these things have been in use for decades and show the wear. Also some are incomplete and lack the cables and/or the manuals. Stay away from them as the cables and manuals can cost as much as the machine. I looked for months to find the one I got. The beauty of these is they are repairable. The assembly manual also has a troubleshooting section and a complete parts list.

Hope this helps,

 

[rikrobson]

you'll be able to see the charging of the condenser and the breakdown in the field cause by the points to generate the current in the secondary coil.

 

[cardiffrob]

Thanks everyone. The unit seems to work and I get the trace as expected but I can't seem to track down anything that decodes the information. I thought that perhaps Crypton or Sun might have produced an instructional training booklet on it. I'll keep looking.
Thanks
Rob

 

[MrFluffy]

Rob, its a heathkit, not a sun or crypton so they're not going to have instructions on its operation. The manual I linked to above has the calibration and use instructions, but you might try a deep dig round the web see if you can find it as a pdf instead of paying $20 for what is probably a print out or photocopy anyway.
Heathkit is a american brand, so possibly better known that side of the pond but a lot of radio enthusiasts and stuff will know their name.

Also worth a poke round youtube :-
https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=heathkit+co-1015

 

[winchman]

One thing it may be good for is it will measure pulses that multimeters won't see as they are too fast, so it can check ignition amps encoders steppers etc.

 

[graffian]

I thought that perhaps Crypton or Sun

I was going to suggest you look for the booklets that come with Crypton tuners, no doubt Sun analyzers came with similar
leaflets/manuals. I think I threw the paperwork that came with mine away, I will look tomorrow.

 

[rikrobson]

I don't think there will be a step by step guide to fault finding with it. its to aid your aquired knowlede and give more information abault how the system is working so YOU can diagnose the fault. Unfortunately its not going to do the diagnosis for you.

 

[cardiffrob]

Here is the best one I've found so far. I'll keep looking.