Linux

[Kayos]

Been a few threads lately, thought I'd share my recent fun

I bought a refurbished Surface Pro 7+ (A Microsoft device) 11th gen i5 @2.4ghz 16gb ram, 256gb SSD

This will be my work laptop

I chose this model because I like them and it's the highest spec without a cooling fan, the i7 has an annoying fan

Installing Linux was not the plan (yet) so I set it with Win 11 Pro, several hours of updates (without the optional new version)

Brought it home, turned it on to be greeted with a bit locker recovery request, and a non functional keyboard. Quick Google suggests a firmware (bios) update has caused this.

I decided not to reinstall Windows, this could be an issue

Ubuntu installed nice, using the Surface Linux Kernel has got nearly everything working. Due to a custom chip the camera don't work. This is annoying because chances are I will need to do a video call at some point

There is some software I need to use, there are no alternatives. This is government issued software. I tried Wine and it's (wrapper) variants and it does not work. This is because it is an access database that calls a suite of small programs. Wine cannot handle this. It also needs Access, Open/Libre office varients do not work, even on Windows. Defeats the object if I do a full Office install and I could not get the Access runtime to run under Wine either

I decided at this point I would try Win 11 in a virtual machine, I went straight to LXD and after a bit of messing about, I have it running at a reasonable speed!

Few pictures, showing Ubuntu, the VM and the hateful software

 

[badabec]

Wine: Windows Is Not Emulated.

I use Ubuntu. If I click on apps, there is an app for a camera.
Maybe try looking for the camera app.

 

[jmp49]

Have you poked round in the bios settings? on the surface pro it has to be enabled in UEFI before any OS can see it, windows or linux.

The only time I use windows not in either a vmware instance, virtual box or qemu kvm, its because some task it runs needs low level access to the gpu and nvidia gpu passthrough always seems a bit hit and miss. And sometimes vmware's serial driver gets in the way when your doing really funky stuff with it, but then so does the mac's under OSX.

I read in one interview with a microsoft exec that they eventually plan to get rid of the mouse/keyboard and just go to some AI assistant deciding what to install/open depending on what you describe to it you want to do. And that right there is a fantastic reason for anyone to get more familiar with linux right now.
My only hole in capability is android is now steadily marching away from the linux on a watch vision, and google long since strangled any real compettitors who did do this.

 

[Islander71]

I am pretty computer illiterate - it just doesn't interest me beyond surfing the web and emails. My problem is that my current PC cannot be updated to Windows 11, and if it could be, there would be no drivers for my perfectly working printer and scanner, so I am tempted to try Linux. The question is , is it easy for a computer dummy to install and use, or does it require quite a bit of computer know how?

 

[cheb]

I am pretty computer illiterate - it just doesn't interest me beyond surfing the web and emails. My problem is that my current PC cannot be updated to Windows 11, and if it could be, there would be no drivers for my perfectly working printer and scanner, so I am tempted to try Linux. The question is , is it easy for a computer dummy to install and use, or does it require quite a bit of computer know how?

I'd say yes it is easy, and doesn't need much computer knowledge. I like Linux Mint, it's simple and has a good support forum.

 

[Kayos]

Wine: Windows Is Not Emulated.

I use Ubuntu. If I click on apps, there is an app for a camera.
Maybe try looking for the camera app.

Even the developers of the surface kernel do not think the camera will ever be cracked on this model

 

[Kayos]

Have you poked round in the bios settings? on the surface pro it has to be enabled in UEFI before any OS can see it, windows or linux.

The only time I use windows not in either a vmware instance, virtual box or qemu kvm, its because some task it runs needs low level access to the gpu and nvidia gpu passthrough always seems a bit hit and miss. And sometimes vmware's serial driver gets in the way when your doing really funky stuff with it, but then so does the mac's under OSX.

I read in one interview with a microsoft exec that they eventually plan to get rid of the mouse/keyboard and just go to some AI assistant deciding what to install/open depending on what you describe to it you want to do. And that right there is a fantastic reason for anyone to get more familiar with linux right now.
My only hole in capability is android is now steadily marching away from the linux on a watch vision, and google long since strangled any real compettitors who did do this.

It boots and runs perfectly (except the camera) as per the pictures

 

[MattF]

Is there any reason you can't use a usb camera?

 

[Kayos]

Is there any reason you can't use a usb camera?

The plan is to not use this for video calls

Obviously as soon as I'm out of the office with only this device, I will need to take a video call

So I am on the lookout for the physically smallest usb camera I can find

 

[OJCar]

I bought a refurbished Surface Pro 7

There's your mistake.

 

[Kayos]

There's your mistake.

Whatever you think of their software, these devices are brilliant, even more so with Linux

I've been using a couple of base spec SP4s but the batteries are now beyond help

 

[Kram]

I've played with linux quite a bit in the past, back before ubuntu and the modern easy to install variants. Its not something I enjoy.

However they are the same scum developers as at Microsoft. I will no longer use any variant after one purposely destroyed my windows install that was on another disk, it had no reason to touch it yet wiped the MBR.

If I had to use it again, theres a good rule of OS's each on a seperate disk, no sharing and unplug the other at install time, although thats less practical on a laptop.

 

[Kayos]

I've played with linux quite a bit in the past, back before ubuntu and the modern easy to install variants. Its not something I enjoy.

However they are the same scum developers as at Microsoft. I will no longer use any variant after one purposely destroyed my windows install that was on another disk, it had no reason to touch it yet wiped the MBR.

If I had to use it again, theres a good rule of OS's each on a seperate disk, no sharing and unplug the other at install time, although thats less practical on a laptop.

I've just (rather than doing actual work) installed Windows 11 in an LXD container on my server, so when I am in the office I can use Windows from an entirely separate machine

 

[jmp49]

It boots and runs perfectly (except the camera) as per the pictures

Yes, I understand that. But the camera is enabled in the bios replacement UEFI too before the underlying os gets to even see it. I read its a OV5693 chipset in the camera thats supported under certain models, but not sure about the 7.
If you want to get it going, it might just be disabled at bios level, or it might be the IPU3 isp controlling it acting weird...
As usual MS have gone away from a normal early boot bios into their own special thingy, because why not reinvent the wheel:

Manage Surface UEFI settings - Surface

Learn how to manage Surface UEFI settings to enable or disable components, configure security, and adjust boot settings on supported Surface devices.

learn.microsoft.com

 

[Kayos]

Yes, I understand that. But the camera is enabled in the bios replacement UEFI too before the underlying os gets to even see it. I read its a OV5693 chipset in the camera thats supported under certain models, but not sure about the 7.
If you want to get it going, it might just be disabled at bios level, or it might be the IPU3 isp controlling it acting weird...
As usual MS have gone away from a normal early boot bios into their own special thingy, because why not reinvent the wheel:

Manage Surface UEFI settings - Surface

Learn how to manage Surface UEFI settings to enable or disable components, configure security, and adjust boot settings on supported Surface devices.

learn.microsoft.com

It's a 7+ so IPU6

https://github.com/linux-surface/linux-surface/discussions/1354

 

[jmp49]

Reading that thread, sounds like the relevant kernel modules etc got merged in 2024 sometime, once its made its way through all the distro maintainers and releases it should be in every distro's release by now, so it should just start working with a bit of messing round once its actually enabled in the uefi bios. You could even contribute back if you had to do something or alter some code.
I quite like cheese for testing camera stuff if your inclined. Besides working pretty reliably, its in every distro, and has a silly name.

 

[Kayos]

Reading that thread, sounds like the relevant kernel modules etc got merged in 2024 sometime, once its made its way through all the distro maintainers and releases it should be in every distro's release by now, so it should just start working with a bit of messing round once its actually enabled in the uefi bios. You could even contribute back if you had to do something or alter some code.
I quite like cheese for testing camera stuff if your inclined. Besides working pretty reliably, its in every distro, and has a silly name.

The camera is enabled in the bios

I may look into it but if I'm honest it isn't a priority

Used it to do some paid work and today so I'm happy