Introduction and a few pictures of my welds

[Specialist]

Hi all, I'm a long time reader here so decided to finally join and post

I'm working as a welding specialist, well actually just got started on it, so I'm learning quite a lot, got to know the theory well, and working on practice. I have experience with MIG and welding altogether, but didn't work a lot with stick, so thats where I'm trying to improve. I have improved over the last few welding jobs, but, there's always room for improvement, and I'd like to master the stick.

I am using an Einhell AC welder that goes up to 160A, single and tri-phase powered (230V and 400V). As some of you would say, a buzzbox
But this one has fan cooling, and it didnt cut out on me even when burning 3.25 electrodes back to back for 10 to 15 min at about 120A.

Picture of the welder:


Specifications table:


So I have tried to join a few pieces I had lying around - first is a fillet join of 1 mm steel sheet, done with a 2 mm electrode type E 6013 at about 60A.

Fillet from behind, showing good penetration and some burn trough:


Fillet from the front, messy join and lot of slag inclusions, also spatter:


I tried to get it going, but it seems these particular 6013's (Jadran S) are not quite good, they tend to stick a lot, and either not penetrate and get slag inclusions, or to easily blow trough. Also, the slag is incedibly hard to chip off.

I tried capping it on a few places with ETC 3,25 mm E 6013, and had much better joining and flow of the metal then with 2 mm 6013 from another manufacturer (which I presumed would be better for 1 mm sheet). Altough it did blow trough on a few places, it was controllable with a little effort.

Coming to that, I bought a 4,5 kg box of ETC 3,25 mm E 6013 for about 10 euro, which is very cheap (read suspicious quality maybe), but turns out to be a very good electrode indeed, after some searching on the net I found out it is a probably licensed Oerlikon rod.

A couple of fast runs on 1 mm steel sheet with ETC 3,25 without blowing trough at around 110A:


Another look at the run, not too clean, but I would think acceptable:


And here is a clean drag run with ETC 3,25 mm on 10 mm steel at about 100A, there are two weld beads one next to other, 2 electrodes burnt:


Another look:


These were quite easy to strike, and it kept a nice steady arc all the way to the end, I'd say for the price it's good quality weld bead.

Here are a few rod tips remaining after welding :


And here is the rod box, anyone seen these before?


Rod specs:


All in all they outperformed my expetactions for the price, really did not see that coming Thanks for reading and taking time to respond, comments are welcome, especially about how to improve on that fillet.

 

[shenion]

Looks good. The smaller rods are difficult to keep under the slag. You cant see well as there is more slag than metal.

For fillets with smaller rods; start hod rod with a small gap at first to warm it up, then drag it along. You will find you may need to up the amps to keep the slag from cooling and causing inclusions.

 

[Specialist]

Thanks for your comments! I have been trying to do something like that, but still keep getting inclusions. Maybe a slight weave motion would help? About amperage, I have tried to up it all the way to about 80A, and then it just kept blowing trough, it got me confused. And slag is so hard it just wont come off without a good few minutes of banging with a hammer? Maybe just the electrodes are simply no good.

 

[shenion]

Are you trying to do 1mm steel with 2.5mm rods? I would say the minimum would be 2mm.

I had the same issues, need to keep the current up and drag rod. If you blow through, you cant reduce the current or the slag will cool.

I have done some 1mm with 1.6mm rods. Still tricky. Was not bad with 7014 rods.

 

[Specialist]

I was trying to do a fillet on 1 mm thick steel sheet with a 2 mm 6013 electrode. It seems tricky from what you say. What is weird, I had more success welding 1 mm sheet with 3,25 mm rod if dragged fast enough. Anyway, would 7014 work with my welder? I know that 7018 need a high OCV - over 70V, while my welder goes up to about 55V. If 7014 are similar, that might be a problem.

I will try to get hold of some thicker material, say 5 to 10 mm to try and make a fillet with 3,25 mm 6013. My goal is to produce a good sample, that would pass laboratory tests for rtg, hardness and impact energy testing (at least 47 J at 0°C as thats what the specs for 6013 call for). When I achieve that, then I'll be satisfied with results. But it still seems like a long way to go.

 

[shenion]

7014's will work nicely. They used to be kinda rare; now I see them popping up more and more. They are a low-to-medium penetration rod (6013's are considered medium.) Unlike other 70xx rods, they do not need to be kept impeccably dry.

Note: 7018's will work fine at 55V. If you have doubts, look for 7018-AC rods. They are optimized for lower-OCV welders.

I have some 1.6mm 7014's made by Hobart (WeldIt brand) and some 2.4mm Lincolns. They are a dream to use, nice smooth arc, very little slag or spatter. The slag is a bit tricky to get off the edges of the weld though. Have only seen the 1.6mmin 1/2lb tubes. Gets real expensive. They work just like the bigger rods, maintain an arc length, move at right speed and you can see the weld pool. Welds do look a bit dull.

Smaller 6013 rods are difficult on fillet welds. I've read all kinds of tutorials, watched videos, read papers and they all grab a 3.2mm rod and have at it. None of them mention how completely different smaller rods are especially on the "feel" of using them..

I did find the larger 6013 work better on thin metals, but still way to hot for corners. Smaller 6013's are hard as there is more flux than metal. Also the "arc length" you normally use is different. The small 6013's outer coating burns slower than the rod melts. So the arc length needs to include the length inside the coating. Normally it is near the diameter of the rod, about right for dragging.

I have 1.6, 2.0 and 2.4mm 6013 rods.

The 1.6mm work well on flats. Not actually 6013, but very close (has slightly higher tensile strength.) Near impossible on fillets. Even dragging the rod, angled back, you can feel it skip over cooled, hardened slag that flows ahead of the weld pool. Need to keep current way up to keep slag from cooling, then rods last about 15 seconds and are like a plasma cutter on thin metal. Really only work well at current settings for 2.0mm rods.

The 2.0mm are ok and I use them often. Does easy positional welds. Some minor slag inclusions. Some off brand, bit not cheap Chinese generic junk.)

The 2.4mm 6013's are Lincoln Fleetweld 47's. Real nice to use on metal down to 2.5mm. Actually are cheaper than the 1.6 and 2.0mm no-name rods (smaller rods only come is small boxes and are more expensive.)

You can try a vertical down or angled up at 45. Makes it easier to not blow through and helps keep slag out of the way.

 

[asmeix6g]

Specialist, "Fillet from behind, showing good penetration and some burn trough"
Wheres the pen'?
dont take this the wrong way but you should learn to walk before you run.
where do you work as a welding specialist and what does the work entail?

 

[Specialist]

Shenion, so that means that an ok 7018 rod should do good. I'll try that when I find some. About 6013's I have also noticed that - they are terrible to control on thin metal, although that could have something to do with me using them on AC. Well I'm certain that they would fare better on DC, but for time being inverter is not on my short list, as decent ones run around at least 300 euro.
I will try your suggestion for a 45 degree run, maybe that will keep the slag right where it should be, on top of the metal And btw, you have a really nice piece of equipment on your pages, I had a look at it and I only wish such luck to pick that up somewhere for some spare change

Asmeix6g, I know that technically looking, that fillet is not adequate. It was not meant to be, it was just a quick run on thin steel to see how those electrodes fare. To be fair, it's awful hehe. Maybe I should had wrote, somewhat acceptable penetration considering how fast it was done

Well the whole life is an learning experience, and just now I'm trying to learn as much as I can about arc welding in practice. Theory is different from practice and it will always be. So thats why I'm here, to learn more. I work in shipbuilding industry. Work revolves main around calculating requirements of welds, selecting appropriate filler material (rods or wire depending on welding process) and testing weld samples in laboratory. Those are all for structural welds, mostly on 10 mm material thickness and up. So I have to have a pretty good knowledge of what I'm doing in order for it to hold up to stress under heavy use. Also it involves implementation of different ISO standards into working with welding, and adhering to requirements for testing imposed on us by the buyers.

 

[shenion]

Look for 7018-AC rods. Usually have a comment on the box similar to "Optimized for smaller AC welders".

Yes DCEN is easier on thin metal.

 

[pejky]

Pozdrav komsija, drago mi je da ima jos neko sa istog govornog podrucja na ovom forumu
Translation for the others who don't understand the text above: Hi neighbour, I'm glad that there is someone from the same lingual territory on this forum.
We live in two neighbour countries.

 

[Specialist]

Pozdrav, i ti se bavis zavarivanjem?

Hello there, you also work in welding industry?

 

[pejky]

To mi je vise kao hobi i dodatni izvor prihoda...
It's more like hobby and a part time job.
And there is more love for metal from day to day

 

[Specialist]

I've been quite busy lately working, it just happens that I had enough free time to do a bit of my own welding. A grid made out of rectangular tubing was the order of the day Fence and such...anyway, I designed a grid door for a fence out of square tubing 20x20x2 mm, and proceeded to weld it with stick, here are a few pictures.

Detail of grid butt joint, about 100 A@3,25 mm E6013:


Another joint:


And another:


Grid completed before grinding:


And an inspirational one


It seems that butt joints are getting quite easy to do properly, nice penetration, good smooth bead appearance, overall I'm quite pleased with most of them. Scratch pad for electrode warm up is a must, as I have discovered, it makes life that much easier. Off course, welding wouldn't be fun without an occasional botched joint, a few had gone that route, but had been repaired after welding, all in all I call it a success, well the grid did not fall apart just yet

 

[Specialist]

So I see quite a few views of this thread, but no comments? Are the welds that bad, or what is it?

 

[bawjaws]

ASMEIX To be honest. They're awful! You came on here saying you were a welding specialist and to be honest you can't even do a simple h/v stick fillet!!! And what the hells goin on with that crap youv attempted to weld together? Of course it won't fall apart you've got about an inch think Bead! Anyone with the tiniest amount of knowledge on the subject would know a single stringer would suffice.

In short by calling yourself a specialist you have shot yourself in the foot! Your an embarrasment to the trade.

dont be nasty to folk , youll soon be kicked off, he said hes a specialist but i think he ment thats what trade he does, he also said that he doesnt have much experience with stick welding and hes trying to improve, help him rather than put him down, it is a diy forum for learners after all



edit- just looked at the pics, they actually look like good welds

 

[JayRS4]

ASMEIX: That`s just plain rude if you ask me, if you actually read his first post properly, yes, he has said he`s a welding specialist, but he also said this was in MIG and he was looking to improve his MMA welding, also, I think you should take into account the possible language barrier. Maybe you should be trying to encourage instead of just putting him down. And remember, this is a DIY forum, not everyone here is a professional

Specialist: As regards your last post, i`ve been looking, but i`m not the best at MMA myself, so i thought i`d hold back on commenting.


Edit: Doh! Baw beat me too it

 

[asmeix6g]

"It seems that butt joints are getting quite easy to do properly, nice penetration, good smooth bead appearance"
a few things iv picked up on....
1) if they are easy to do then why dont you do a good one and show us!?
2) good penetration? how can you tell!?
as i said previously walk before you can run you cant just come on here weld like crap then tell everyone its good and acceptable! people on here are learning to weld and probably far better yet they still wont profess to be a top welder or specialist!

And ASMEIX nice name maybe you can be more original next time??

 

[malcolm]

And ASMEIX nice name maybe you can be more original next time??

You could have asked him yourself - you just missed meeting him in person by a few seconds. Tell you what, I'll send you a PM. If you see ASMEIX please ask him not to post again. Heck, I'll ask him in my own special way.

Apologies Specialist - this ASMEIX character was a made up user used for trolling.

 

[bawjaws]

they look like good welds for a beginer, and i wasnt meaning mirror finish perfect looking welds i was talking about the strength, go away now asmeix, or stay if your actually willing to help the guy

 

[asmeix6g]

send me a PM? errmm ok then...... hmmmopjn9uy