Installing a standby generator

[brewdexta]

The supply up in t'Pennines is up and down like the Assyrian empire. I've seen a nice Lister 3.5KVA gen set with electric start within easy collecting distance, looks to be in very good nick.

But I have a dilemma, I haven't got around to build the plant room around the back of the house yet, that's next years task. This will be the permanent home for the gennie and it is near the outside meter box and consumer unit so I can get the correct change over switch installed.

Last year we were without power for several days during the winter, so no heating, hot water etc. I was working away so the family moved out to the relatives so ideally I need a means of hooking this up before I build the plant room.

The meter box has a manual cut off switch, very handy if your working on the consumer unit. I have 10mm SWA from the consumer unit out to the barn where I could site the gennie. I left a loop of a few metres on the SWA so I could take it into the new plant room when ready.

I now have a separate consumer unit in the barn with an RCD, there is also an RCD on the main house consumer unit feeding the barn which I intended to swap for an MCB but haven't got around to it yet.

Is there a safe and legal way of hooking the gennie up in the barn so I can feed the house/barn if there is a power cut without frying the guys working on the grid? I'm not too bothered about automatic start, nice to have but not important compared to keeping the kids warm when we get snowed in.

I will of course be getting a spark to do this but I thought I would get some info from the brains on the forum first.

Cheers
Andy

 

[madkayaker]

Earthing needs to be TT if you have a standby gen set. Auto or manual change over switch between meter and consumer unit. 10mm is plenty for that size genny. Do a google for deep sea controller there the dogs dangles for control panel and if you get right one will give auto start, brown out protection and cool down run timer on engine. I deal with some very big sets at work including a 1800kva @6.6kv and two our of 6 have deep sea units ( rest have control system leftover by Noah)

 

[brewdexta]

Earthing needs to be TT if you have a standby gen set. Auto or manual change over switch between meter and consumer unit. 10mm is plenty for that size genny. Do a google for deep sea controller there the dogs dangles for control panel and if you get right one will give auto start, brown out protection and cool down run timer on engine. I deal with some very big sets at work including a 1800kva @6.6kv and two our of 6 have deep sea units ( rest have control system leftover by Noah)

Thanks for the info

I'm looking at two units, one comes with all the switch gear from the original installation, and another is a bit cheaper but has no switch gear, I'm guessing the Deep Sea unit renders the original switch gear redundant?

I looked at the Deep Sea stuff, looks good and they manufacture in the UK. However there seems to be similar branded kit on ebay from China, are these cheap copies?

Cheers
Andy

 

[madkayaker]

The deep sea controller drives the switchgear don't know about china Copy only deal with genuine

 

[the snooper]

don't forget that 3.5 kva is only a small output it only has slightly more power then 1 13amp wall socket

 

[brewdexta]

don't forget that 3.5 kva is only a small output it only has slightly more power then 1 13amp wall socket

That should be enought to keep us at home, it should power the heating pump, fridge, freezer, broadband router and the odd PC and lighting until the power comes back on. There is a nice 10KVA unit not far way but physically much bigger and twice the price.I usually like to super-size things so they are on top of their game but we haven't had an outage more than 2 days yet and we can do without the washing machine, dishwasher etc. for a while.

 

[rikrobson]

and we can do without the washing machine, dishwasher etc. for a while.

Does she leave home when the 'leckys off????

 

[brewdexta]

Does she leave home when the 'leckys off????

She's on her way round to tell you herself

 

[Shox Dr]

I'd be adding up the items that never turn off ie fridge, freezer etc, then factor in TV kettle, lights etc.

I think you will have a fright when you see how much it adds upto. More than 3.5kva that is a fact. And also remember a lot of these gennies quote the highest ouput they can give, but if run at that for any length of time it will burn the windings out.

The greasy spoon I use has gone through countless units around 3-6kva in the last few yrs, and all she runs is a microwave, 3 strip lights and 2 fridges, the rest is on gas

 

[the snooper]

There is a nice 10KVA unit not far way but physically much bigger and twice the price.

and will cost more to run, freezers usually last 24 hours before thawing out so that could be switched off for a while when you need to use bigger things

 

[brewdexta]

I hear you Dave, however I (hopefully) will only be using it a couple of days a year max, I can get a 3.5KVA for about 700 -800 quid in reasonable nick then I guess it will be 200 - 300 fitting. For a 10KVA its about £2K plus fitting.

I shall have a think, I don't usually do half measures so may end up with something bigger!

 

[Robotstar5]

Have you considered the PV (solar panel) route? charging a battery bank (seen S/H fork truck batteries used) with an inverter to power the house.
Used most of the time to go "off grid" and cut your 'leccy bills and available when there's a power cut.

 

[madkayaker]

In Yorkshire it would take all year to get one kWh!

 

[Pete.]

I ran my house one night on a 5kva diesel genny. Fridge, central heating, tv & broadband, few lights. No kettle or microwave but we have a gas cooker to make tea. Had to fill the little tank up every couple of hrs until bedtime then it ran 6 hrs just keeping the fridge and heating going.

 

[madkayaker]

I have used my 3kva before ran fridge, freezer and power to boiler for hot water. Last time lecky board were very please of the hot coffee I took them when in 5oC there changing a pole

 

[lshigham]

We used to have a 6kva diesel, coped OK until the immersion heater kicked in!

 

[brewdexta]

Have you considered the PV (solar panel) route? charging a battery bank (seen S/H fork truck batteries used) with an inverter to power the house.
Used most of the time to go "off grid" and cut your 'leccy bills and available when there's a power cut.

I have a large space on the barn roof, its not ideally oriented, E/W rather than N/S but would work. I have considered it and the feed in tarriff is a good deal but as the output will be a lot less than the very optimistic figures given I thought I would wait until more cost effective technology comes out.

I also have a stream with a very large drop, but its very seasonal. It did go across the field underground in an old stone drain that collapsed, when it rained heavy water would jet out of the ground around the blockage. I dug it up and laid about 80 metres of 250mm pipe, and while I was at it dropped in some 6mm SWA and exterior grade CAT5 into the trench. I did look at a bit of hydro kit for it, but it remains a future project at the moment. (The CAT5 was for the Pig cam )

I've looked at wind power (the brewery helps ) but I have power poles in the field which makes it difficult to place one optimally.

Anyway, back to the plot I have the devil on one shoulder shouting 10KVA and the angel on the other saying 3.5KVA is OK to get you by without breaking the bank. I shall chat to her indoors......

 

[brightspark]

I have a large space on the barn roof, its not ideally oriented, E/W rather than N/S but would work. I have considered it and the feed in tarriff is a good deal but as the output will be a lot less than the very optimistic figures given I thought I would wait until more cost effective technology comes out.

I also have a stream with a very large drop, but its very seasonal. It did go across the field underground in an old stone drain that collapsed, when it rained heavy water would jet out of the ground around the blockage. I dug it up and laid about 80 metres of 250mm pipe, and while I was at it dropped in some 6mm SWA and exterior grade CAT5 into the trench. I did look at a bit of hydro kit for it, but it remains a future project at the moment. (The CAT5 was for the Pig cam )

I've looked at wind power (the brewery helps ) but I have power poles in the field which makes it difficult to place one optimally.

Anyway, back to the plot I have the devil on one shoulder shouting 10KVA and the angel on the other saying 3.5KVA is OK to get you by without breaking the bank. I shall chat to her indoors......

get the 10 k unit u wont regret it and it will hold its price .

 

[wyn]

I have a large space on the barn roof, its not ideally oriented, E/W rather than N/S but would work. QUOTE]

I read something today saying that in the northern hemisphere solar panels facing west generate 2% more electric than those facing south.

 

[brewdexta]

I read something today saying that in the northern hemisphere solar panels facing west generate 2% more electric than those facing south.

That's interesting but counter to the data I have seen. I also have some big hills to cope with so tend to get less sunlight than the average pit pony