idea: converting a barn into a bathhouse.

[Sergei Slovenija]

The landlord is not against it, especially since the investment will be returned from the rent of the bathhouse. And he is ready to participate in the project with both hands and money. For the third day, I have been making calculations for the purchase of materials that cannot be done without. Secondary materials will be used as much as possible. In the plans: a dome sauna made of adobe. A homemade wood-burning stove-heater.

 

[Sergei Slovenija]

there is a powerful barn, with structures made of timber with a cross-section of 250 * 250 + concrete tiles. Strip concrete foundation. Adobe needs to be protected from rain, and the idea is to build a warm circuit inside the perimeter of the walls. The outer boards can be removed and then put back, adding windows and doors. The barn gates will remain as decoration or will move to a nearby, more ancient classic Slovenian barn for drying hay.

 

[gaz1]

id change you and improve your thinking

leave the shed alone for something else



whilst they use less wood it still provides enough seating along its length compared to a square or retangle base

the one thing with a barrel sauna they dont have to be fully round you can square off the base whilst having the top in a round shape

 

[Sergei Slovenija]

id change you and improve your thinking

leave the shed alone for something else

View attachment 467087View attachment 467088

whilst they use less wood it still provides enough seating along its length compared to a square or retangle base

the one thing with a barrel sauna they dont have to be fully round you can square off the base whilst having the top in a round shape

Well, apparently, you can't imagine the budget for good building materials for such a small barrel, where a couple of rusty old herrings barely find a place.

We are talking about a fairly large dome, 3 meters high and up to 20 m2 or a little less. A bathhouse for steaming with a birch broom, you need to think about, starting from the stove, having entered into the existing volume of auxiliary rooms. which sets a difficult task. The barn is filled to the brim with old junk that requires disposal and the landlord understands this. Plus, this allows you to gracefully bypass local urban planning bureaucratic permits.

 

[gaz1]

now if you was building a brick dome i could point you in the direction of tubing around the dome to the top that is well insulated

and because its insulated the heat will reflect back into the brick structure

as goes for heating it well a rocket stove or the use of secondary air can be used to heat the structure up though a rocket stove will conserve the wood usage really well

 

[Sergei Slovenija]

now if you was building a brick dome i could point you in the direction of tubing around the dome to the top that is well insulated

and because its insulated the heat will reflect back into the brick structure

as goes for heating it well a rocket stove or the use of secondary air can be used to heat the structure up though a rocket stove will conserve the wood usage really well

I looked at all the options for erecting adobe walls, especially a dome. The current working version for my conditions: a frame made of long poles bent to a radius, intertwined with branches + manual plastering with a hard version of adobe. 15 cm thick. A vertical belt 1500 high and a dome part, 1500 high, within these limits.

Heating: I consulted with real practitioners of rocket mass stoves in adobe houses, their opinion is that this stove is not suitable for generating steam from a mass of steam stones of 100 kg.

There is a good working version of a stove like the Finnish Harvi for a sauna, I selected an option for self-production. Quite economical consumption of firewood, based on 5 people in a bathhouse.

power 20 kW, and by changing the dimensions, you can increase the power of the furnace.

There is water heating and disposal of burning exhaust gases in a massive heat accumulator, but this is not a rocket stove.

 

[Sergei Slovenija]

Hard adobe: clay, sand and 10% straw reinforcement for walls. A second layer of insulation may be needed with lightweight adobe, where straw is 90% and clay is 10%. Plaster a thin layer of hydraulic lime inside. I want to try test samples with the addition of ground into powder burnt brick and tiles, according to the principle of Roman mortar for waterproofing water tanks. The main mental problem: how to make a horizontal mixer for adobe, its tubular part. Buying even a used one is a lot of money, about 3,000 euros. gearbox, motors. metal, I have all this. Any ideas and experience are welcome.

 

[Sergei Slovenija]

For the area of the barn, for the construction of walls, dome and ceilings, based on 15 cm of wall and ceiling thickness, according to our estimates, up to 12 m3 of adobe will be needed. The quality of local free clay will determine during testing what ratio of sand will be needed. 1:2, 1:3, 1:4 and so on. Mechanization of mixing is absolutely necessary, you can’t do so much with shovels and feet. A barn of 32 m2 by floor area will be divided into 2 parts. And a warm circuit is needed everywhere. To fit into these dimensions a large steam dome room, a shower, a dressing room and space for a table and rest between steam sessions. Solid compromises.

 

[gaz1]

clay is already in bricks so building a dome shape out of them is worth it

as goes for heating the walls building tubes is the next best option as your heating the walls with this

a standared rocket stove can do this with the use of a rocket stove the output of fine particles is really low so less clean out on the structure

 

[gaz1]

as long as the spirals of heat are run up to the top it all depends on which system you choose to use and dont forget secondary air can be used

dont forget to install cleanouts at every so often to clean them

because these are fired sideways you can add hot water system to them

 

[gaz1]

you want a pan mixer either wheels or blades for a horizontal cement mixer

for the outside use renewable straw bales for insulation as there r rating is high r 20 too r30 and even r40 depending how they are packed

that means one fire a day and that shell will remain warm to hot for a few days

 

[Sergei Slovenija]

clay is already in bricks so building a dome shape out of them is worth it

as goes for heating the walls building tubes is the next best option as your heating the walls with this

a standared rocket stove can do this with the use of a rocket stove the output of fine particles is really low so less clean out on the structure

uhm. I am a fan of minimal budgets for such experiments, but not at the expense of functionality and obtaining the desired characteristics as a result. Acquiring new skills and knowledge is a bonus of the bathhouse project. We are not talking about any factory bricks, cubic meters of planed wood, etc. I use the TRIZ methodology and functional cost analysis in my practice. Everything can be reduced to several questions: how much does it cost and what function does it perform and is it possible to do without this element? The ideal solution: the functionality continues to be performed, but the element is no longer there.

 

[Sergei Slovenija]

as long as the spirals of heat are run up to the top it all depends on which system you choose to use and dont forget secondary air can be used

dont forget to install cleanouts at every so often to clean them

because these are fired sideways you can add hot water system to them

I am familiar with the heating system of the ondol or kan type, in many years of practical archaeological work and excavation exercises. It looks practical and interesting, but is difficult to implement and configure. The bathhouse is not a model for saving on firewood. There are costs and they are included in the price of the session. A reasonable compromise will be reached.

 

[Sergei Slovenija]

you want a pan mixer either wheels or blades for a horizontal cement mixer

for the outside use renewable straw bales for insulation as there r rating is high r 20 too r30 and even r40 depending how they are packed

that means one fire a day and that shell will remain warm to hot for a few days

I believe that the second layer of insulation, made of lightweight adobe, straw/sawdust/wood shavings 9 parts, clay 1 part, will fulfill its task without being a structural element of the walls.

I am not so advanced in eco-consciousness that I would bother with stacking straw bales in the walls and then solving the problem of their vapor barrier, protection from mice, reduction of useful areas, etc. Moreover, our farmers do not make straw bales, only huge rolls.

 

[gaz1]

i had looked up straw for insulation

it did bring to attention that mice dont like to make homes in tightly packed straw bales yes they will in gaps and becuse they are straw they are well insulated within the winter months

as goes for the straw i tend to remember the wood and straw built homes

worth reading

https://tallerconco.org/wp-content/uploads/2017/05/The-influence-of-natural-reinforcement-fibres-on-insulation-values-of-earth-plaster-for-straw-bale-buildings.pdf

http://schoolofnaturalbuilding.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2022/03/Technical-Guide-UK-Feb-2022-1.pdf

 

[gaz1]

I am familiar with the heating system of the ondol or kan type, in many years of practical archaeological work and excavation exercises. It looks practical and interesting, but is difficult to implement and configure. The bathhouse is not a model for saving on firewood. There are costs and they are included in the price of the session. A reasonable compromise will be reached.

yeah that style is different but if used like a long chamber all the way up it acts like a chimney

its sort of like a copper coil wraped around a dome building or within its walls it will heat up as far as it can

but used in a chimney style the chimney is the exit of the gasses of the fire therefore heating the structure up

 

[gaz1]

as i did some digging into waterproofing and was really looking into roman type as i know it within many cellers

the stuff i was interested within was pool water proofing also used with steam rooms