Generators

[puffernutter]

As well as welding (as a hobby) I show and breed Clumber Spaniels and Italian Spinone (www.whissgig.co.uk). Some shows we go as a day trip, others we use the caravan. The show sites don't have electric, so we use a generator. I recently had a secondhand Honda that used enough oil in 2 hours to stop due to the oil-warning!! I now have a second-hand Powerflo PFG 20 INV (I think its roots are in Kippor). Anyway, I used it for the first time a couple of weeks ago and it will go for an hour, then stop! It's then a sod to restart and you have to use the choke on a hot engine, so I wonder if it is fuel starvation. I tried it again today, same issue, 2 hours and it stops, then a sod to restart. I've stripped the carb out and given it a good clean. No change (in fact - worse, now it only runs for a few seconds (I'll strip it again tomorrow and see what I've cocked up!!)
So, the question is, any experience on this forum, any recommendations (that are affordable!) Honda are supposed to be the best, but my last one was terrible and a new 2kW is £1220! It has to be quietish and affordable also minimum 2kW as is supplies both mine and my daughters caravan. Should I get this one repaired? Oh and I need a genny for Friday!!! I'm stewarding at Bournemouth show and staying in the caravan! I could fit a largish diesel one in the van, there were a couple for sale here a couple of years ago, but I hesitated and lost. Sorry for the ramble, thoughts, suggestions?
Cheers
Peter
(Trowbridge, Wiltshire)

 

[the snooper]

2 hours is a long time to run before cutting out, is the tank vacuuming cutting the fuel off, is it a 4 stroke if so check the valve clearances it could be that they are to tight although again 2 hours is a long time and it should be at max temp before then.

when it cuts out and wont start does it still have a spark ?

 

[Robotstar5]

We bought a Hyundai from just generators last year, pretty good apart from AVR failing at 100 hours run, phoned service dept, and they posted a replacement out the same day so can't complain. Link

 

[puffernutter]

Thanks for the quick reply. There is a vent tap on the cap and I've made sure that's open. When it first did it, I loosened the cap as well, so I'm sure it isn't vacuuming.
I haven't checked for spark. I'll try that tomorrow. My earlier gennies had a physical connection between the carb throttle and the generator, this one has a servo on top. Could the control circuits be overheating, playing up? I normally leave it on "smart control", however turning that off forces it to run at full revs and it just dies even sooner (that's why I wonder if it is fuel starvation). Although, with an ECU so to speak, how could I test that as a possible failure mode?
Cheers
Peter

 

[the snooper]

some gennys have an over temp cut out, I repaired one where it had gone faulty and was also killing the ignition so well worth a check for the spark as it could be the culprit

 

[the snooper]

are you sure its a powerflo and not a kipor sinemaster as sinemaster is all I can find relating to PFG 20 INV

 

[dannyp]

check if there is a filter anywhere, couple of mine had intank filters that blocked easy. right pita also gravty fed carbs are funny about inline filters for some reason the angel they are at will affect if fuel will pass or not.

 

[puffernutter]

OK, thanks more things to look for! It has Powerflo on it, but all I could find (when Googling) was Sinemaster (which appears to be Kippor anyway!)

How noisy is that 3kW frame generator?

Cheers

Peter

 

[awemawson]

Peter, Assuming the generator itself is ok on the original Honda that you have, have you considered replacing the engine with one of the clones that abound. I have a Belle cement mixer that my builder succeeded in destroying the engine on. I replaced it with a clone and I've actually been very impressed with the build quality, ease of starting etc and it was a small fraction of the Honda price

 

[wristpin]

One of the best clones is Loncin, who, I'm told, build engines for several well know companies including a certain German motor cycle manufacturer!

 

[Rig Pig]

The origanal generator probably only needs a set of rings, I would look at that first. A genuine Honda genny will knock the spots off all the Chineese clones for reliable power.

 

[Robotstar5]

How noisy is that 3kW frame generator?

69db

 

[dannyp]

the chineese clones are ok for intermitant use, but as soon as you ask them to start working hard and for any length of time they soon fail, the carbs on the copys are crap as well

 

[puffernutter]

OK, this is the current status. The Honda was sold on and as much as I like the Honda product, I cannot justify the expense. With the one I have (probably 2kW Kippor) tonight I have removed and thoroughly cleaned the carburetor. It started and ran for just over 1 hour, plenty of fresh fuel left. It started easily afterwards but only ran for a few minutes. I put a 500W (halogen light) load on the generator and had it on "Smart" setting, so it powered according to load. Listening to it, it would occasionally race away. I'm not even sure where to start, but as it cost me £350, I don't want to just junk it (but with the amount of electronics in it, I could spend a fortune changing things out and never really solve the problem! I'm also away in the caravan on Friday this week and could do with a generator working by then!

I suspect one of the biggest issues is that the generator gets very little use (3 or 4 times a year) and then for a about 3 or 4 hours a day in that period. With the modern fuels, I suspect I'm better off running it for at least 1 hour a month on some sot of load to stop the varnish build up?

Cheers

Peter

 

[awemawson]

I have two small generators that get dragged out only very occasionally to keep our private sewage plant running during power cuts. Probably 4 or 5 times a year (overhead line supply). They can be asked to run continuously for on occasions 10-12 hours and have no problem answering the demands put on them. Both are ancient and based on Briggs and Stratton engines and have absolutely no hint of electronics on them One is 2.5 kW the other 4kW. So I don't see why your occasional usage should be a problem.

 

[puffernutter]

I've been told by one supplier that modern fuel starts to degrade in about a month and small (modern) generators are very sensitive to it. I've been advised that if it is not to be used or a month, then drain as much as I can, then run it dry. As another experiment, I ran the beast on full power this afternoon and it lasted 45 minutes, spluttered and died! Next I think is to drain the tank, wash it through and change the fuel filter. If it still plays up after that, not sure where to go. Eldest son has suggested to rule out the electronics, disconnect the servo electrics from the carb, leave it at a mid setting and see what happens. Could be worth a try!

Cheers

Peter

 

[awemawson]

You don't by any chance have a blocked vent in the petrol tank causing a negativ e pressure and no fuel flow after a period?

 

[Rig Pig]

Try using some see through tubing for the fuel line to the carb so you can make sure it's not a supply problem

 

[puffernutter]

Good idea! I'l try that!

 

[the snooper]

did you check for a spark once it had died ?, if it was bad fuel it wouldnt run for 45 mins
also when its an ignition fault they die suddenly, with fuel you tend to get some spluttering or uneven running first