Fumes respirator mask

[Ged93]

Hey there

Some weeks ago i bought a double shield mask for grinding and welding with a respirator system , this stuff works great but I found a little issue so I would like to compare to any other who uses a respirator ( the brand is CleanAir Basic EVO )

It's a typical motor and filter that stays behind me with a belt , then a tube goes from there to the inside of the mask , my face is covered around by a special fabric to don't let fumes/sparks go in , so only fresh air comes in . Well I've noticed that while I'm grinding , sometimes , I can smell a bit of 'grinding odour' , not so much but it's a bit annoying . I found on the manufacturer catalogue a pre-filter made with activated carbons which should catch odours , but the problem still remains .

I made some mods : I made me a special soft bag which holds completely the filter/motor body , and things are getting better , the second one is to change the fabric inside the mask with a heavier one which does not allow hodours to pass ( I've made some tests and that looks like to be the main problem )

So my question is if anyone of you guys had some kind of 'problems' like mine with grinding odours with respirator masks .

Just to clarify my dealer checked all the system and he told me that it's ok and well assembled

Thanks

 

[Parm]

It’s not a make and model I’m aware off

if you have to modify anything of this nature then it rings major alarm bells for me. It’s not good.

see if you can get the deceleration of conformity of the device and I will look into things.

 

[mike os]

What @Parm said

 

[Munkul]

These filters, even the carbon impregnated ones, won't catch all of the odours. Ask anyone who wears airfed what it's like when you fart - it gets sucked straight up and into your face!!
3M adflo are the only ones to my knowledge that can take a clip on properly rated gas filter, I imagine you'd get no odour at all with those.

 

[Parm]

These filters, even the carbon impregnated ones, won't catch all of the odours. Ask anyone who wears airfed what it's like when you fart - it gets sucked straight up and into your face!!
3M adflo are the only ones to my knowledge that can take a clip on properly rated gas filter, I imagine you'd get no odour at all with those.

Nope.
You cannot use PAPR for protection from gasses. The systems work at a minimum design flow rate of 140 lites of sir per minute. That’s just way to much to allow a sensible dwell time to allow gasses or solvents to adsorb on a filter

they don’t make such filters for these systems fir a reason

 

[Anguz]

These filters, even the carbon impregnated ones, won't catch all of the odours. Ask anyone who wears airfed what it's like when you fart - it gets sucked straight up and into your face!!
3M adflo are the only ones to my knowledge that can take a clip on properly rated gas filter, I imagine you'd get no odour at all with those.

Worse still when someone else farts into it
Not that i would ever do such a thing

 

[Munkul]

Nope.
You cannot use PAPR for protection from gasses. The systems work at a minimum design flow rate of 140 lites of sir per minute. That’s just way to much to allow a sensible dwell time to allow gasses or solvents to adsorb on a filter

they don’t make such filters for these systems fir a reason

Yes, actually.

https://www.3m.co.uk/3M/en_GB/company-uk/3m-products/~/3M-Adflo-Gas-Filter-A1B1E1-837242/?N=5002385+3292824902&rt=rud

No idea in what situation it's designed to be used for, but they DO make them.

They clip directly over the top of the particle filter, much like sundstrom filters can piggyback. Never used them personally so I'm not commenting on appropriateness.

Not actually sure what on earth you mean, here actually... there are loads of powered gas filter respirators on the market... Are you telling me that 3M, Draeger, Sundstrom, et al are all wrong?

 

[Parm]

Yes, actually.

https://www.3m.co.uk/3M/en_GB/company-uk/3m-products/~/3M-Adflo-Gas-Filter-A1B1E1-837242/?N=5002385+3292824902&rt=rud

No idea in what situation it's designed to be used for, but they DO make them.

They clip directly over the top of the particle filter, much like sundstrom filters can piggyback. Never used them personally so I'm not commenting on appropriateness.

Not actually sure what on earth you mean, here actually... there are loads of powered gas filter respirators on the market... Are you telling me that 3M, Draeger, Sundstrom, et al are all wrong?

“Gas” is a big word and often misunderstood. Look up and Quoting info from the internet is fine, but you have to know what you are doing

 

[Munkul]

“Gas” is a big word and often misunderstood. Look up and Quoting info from the internet is fine, but you have to know what you are doing

Correct.

In this context, it's not relevant, is it? The OP isn't asking for protection from a certain gas, he just wants rid of nuisance odours?
A small bit of carbon cloth won't do it (although sometimes advertised as helping with odours, it's not tested as doing so, not in these welding PAPR systems) so I showed something that would, and incidentally, protect against actual gasses, when used in the correct manner.
I was only showing the proper filters to contrast the difference between them, and the carbon inpregnated cloth.

I know you know more about me than the subject, but right here, all you're doing is being very obfuscating, and actually, quite condescending, for no reason at all. How about being helpful?

 

[Ged93]

Guys , please ...
That's why I was asking if anybody else uses a filtering mask just to understand if the odour issue is normal . Again , the entire system works well , while welding I don't smell anything , while grinding sometimes a small amount of odour comes in , then disappears but I would like to prevent this .

Tests I've made showed me that , maybe , the problem is the 'bag' that seals the head/face while wearing the mask , it seems that the fabric could leave to pass a bit the odour .
So my personal seamstress ( mom ) is making an accessory like these from 3M , so I will have more protection from odour but also from sparks ( low row , in the middle ) :

 

[Parm]

Correct.

In this context, it's not relevant, is it? The OP isn't asking for protection from a certain gas, he just wants rid of nuisance odours?
A small bit of carbon cloth won't do it (although sometimes advertised as helping with odours, it's not tested as doing so, not in these welding PAPR systems) so I showed something that would, and incidentally, protect against actual gasses, when used in the correct manner.
I was only showing the proper filters to contrast the difference between them, and the carbon inpregnated cloth.

I know you know more about me than the subject, but right here, all you're doing is being very obfuscating, and actually, quite condescending, for no reason at all. How about being helpful?

I get what you are saying, but you cant just stick a carbon filter or anything else on the filter.

The bit of kit will be designed and conformity assessed by a reputable organisation (Notified Body) to demonstrate that it meets the performance requirements of BS EN 12491. Any modification no matter how big or small nullifies that certification as it will not have been tested with it in place. Adding an extra layer of filter that is not designed to be there will almost certainly affect the draw of air through the fan filter unit and reduce performance of the system

I was helpful in my first very post by suggesting to the OP that if information could be provided i will look into matters. I say this as there are a large number of fake products out there that are accompanied by very convincing forged documentation. I was prepared to look into things and provide feedback and help out

No such information has been provided

Im out of this one

 

[Munkul]

I wasn't suggesting modifying anything, lol

 

[Ged93]

I'll solve on my own through the dealer as nothing helpful is coming out here

Thanks anyway

 

[Parm]

I'll solve on my own through the dealer as nothing helpful is coming out here

Thanks anyway

I suggested to you to provide information and i would help.

Im not going support or endorse the modification of respiratory protective equipment

 

[MattF]

I'll solve on my own through the dealer as nothing helpful is coming out here

Thanks anyway

Try listening to, & working with, Parm, so that he can help you. He does know what he's talking about.

 

[Pigeon_Droppings2]

I bought the 3m adflo with the grinding mask (m300)...I didn't smell anything coming thro while I was grinding/wire wheeling etc but I'm pretty sure the std filter it comes with only deals with nuisance smells ...it's not a dedicated gas filter.

Didn't realise they did an upgrade filter for the adflo...looks like it attaches to the same case over the top of the dust filter....interesting ....might have to look at that to see what the spec is. I usually opt for the 3m vapour masks for things that involve painting and fumes (not iso...I don't do iso painting!)

I'm not convinced a few mm of carbon will do much....in the house I have a proper air cleaner setup and I think the filter is pretty big!

This is the activated carbon on the filter I have in the house...it's inches thick.

 

[Ged93]

Found the conformity declaration , take a look !

 

[Ged93]

You need to download and then open

 

[Munkul]

Guys , please ...
That's why I was asking if anybody else uses a filtering mask just to understand if the odour issue is normal . Again , the entire system works well , while welding I don't smell anything , while grinding sometimes a small amount of odour comes in , then disappears but I would like to prevent this .

The main principle behind PAPR is to blow more air into the hood than you can suck from outside. Therefore, you will breathe filtered air from the PAPR, rather than pulling air from around the edges of the mask. That's why it's not a face-fit tight seal. It doesn't need to be, and it's not designed to be.

As I said earlier, the particle filter and even a small bit of carbon filter - it doesn't, and won't, do much to prevent odours they all do it... my Esab unit, the 3M units, the Optrel units. You can still smell stuff through them.

Modifying your hood or blower won't fix the problem, in fact it might interfere with the correct operation of the PAPR system as it's been designed (Which I guess is what Parm was trying to get at)

Also if you suspect that the blower isn't blowing enough air, or if it's passing unfiltered air, there may be a problem with your blower unit.

 

[Ged93]

Manufacturer told me by mail that with the stock filter and carbon pre-filter I should not smell anything , he suppose a leak somewhere , but he said that to block any gas or odour generated by welding and grinding contaminated metal ( oil , grease ... ) it's necessary to use a double filter system

Yes I see what you mean , I think any modification to filter and mask would not solve the problem , at least at 100% as the pressure is keeping dust and smoke out so the only way it finds to get in is the filter , so that's the problem .

Thank guys