- Thread starter erenkcms
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matt1978
www.lorch.eu
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Which model is it?
If its a M20xx M30xx or M-Pro is automatic active inductance and will adjust itself depending on what voltage position you have selected.
If its a C-Dialog, P Series or S Series, its as above, but you can over ride the setting in one of the background menus.
If its a M20xx M30xx or M-Pro is automatic active inductance and will adjust itself depending on what voltage position you have selected.
If its a C-Dialog, P Series or S Series, its as above, but you can over ride the setting in one of the background menus.
GrahamGKD
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Hi Matt, From his other post on here I suspect erenkcms is building his own welding equipment and is keen to find out how the circuitry works - i.e. how the function of a choke is emulated in electronic circuitry?
thank you
thank you for your answer..
GrahamGKD , you dont need suspect about it, if you asked me , i would answer you.you are right,i am electrical and electronics engineer and i am trying to find out welding machines by me.. so is it problem? because all detail are configured by me..i dont copy any things.. i want to know how it can work(i want to learn logic , and i will try it in my laboratory)..
for example now i am using ARM cortex M3 for my machine and i am trying to do mig machine and it has almost been completed..but i have seen some machines using electronic choke and i wonder that and i want to try it but before that i have to learn its logic and i will write code in my core.
thank you everybody for supporting..
knowledge is for sharing..
thank you for your answer..
GrahamGKD , you dont need suspect about it, if you asked me , i would answer you.you are right,i am electrical and electronics engineer and i am trying to find out welding machines by me.. so is it problem? because all detail are configured by me..i dont copy any things.. i want to know how it can work(i want to learn logic , and i will try it in my laboratory)..
for example now i am using ARM cortex M3 for my machine and i am trying to do mig machine and it has almost been completed..but i have seen some machines using electronic choke and i wonder that and i want to try it but before that i have to learn its logic and i will write code in my core.
thank you everybody for supporting..
knowledge is for sharing..
GrahamGKD
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No, not a problem at all, the majority of us on here are more interested in (and knowledgeable on) using welders of various types rather than building them, although there are a few exceptions. Presumably an electronic choke would attempt to apply a controllable level of smoothing to the current flowing through the welding circuit, which should be achievable if I am right?
Good luck with finding your answer.
yes i agree with you about attemt to current..but how can we do that??
for example we are controlling output voltage level and we have to set it as user input. but how can we adjust of choke?? Will we immediately change level of current or another things??
on the other hand you can adjust choke value as duty(%)..this means that level of current or another thing?
i am searching lots of docement for learning about it something but i couldnt find anything
for example we are controlling output voltage level and we have to set it as user input. but how can we adjust of choke?? Will we immediately change level of current or another things??
on the other hand you can adjust choke value as duty(%)..this means that level of current or another thing?
i am searching lots of docement for learning about it something but i couldnt find anything
shenion
Tool Pack Rat
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The choke smooths the current. It is important in short-arc transfer MIG; the inductance stores energy during the short and then dumps it in the arc period. This reduces the spatter and increases the heat added to the weld pool. It increases the duty cycle of the short-arc process.
On stick, it controls the "harshness" of the weld a bit.
On the Lincoln, I had, the variable inductance was an inductor on the output lead. This had a secondary winding of many turns that was connected to a small board that had an adjustable voltage clamping circuit. So, it limited the rate the inductor could build energy.
On stick, it controls the "harshness" of the weld a bit.
On the Lincoln, I had, the variable inductance was an inductor on the output lead. This had a secondary winding of many turns that was connected to a small board that had an adjustable voltage clamping circuit. So, it limited the rate the inductor could build energy.
shenion
Tool Pack Rat
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The MIG did not have to change the output connection. As I said, it changed the clamping voltage on the coil. Coul dbe done with software if you have software controlled clamp voltage on the coil.
Emulating inductance in software would take high-speed control and the ability to up the output voltage (200V or so.) Something you only see on high end machines like the Lincolns with STT. They need to change voltage in the order of microseconds.
Emulating inductance in software would take high-speed control and the ability to up the output voltage (200V or so.) Something you only see on high end machines like the Lincolns with STT. They need to change voltage in the order of microseconds.
it is so difficult to change clamb on coil, it depends on mmechanical control.
i am using ARM Cortex M3 which is very fast.
İ can change voltage levels in microseconds but why and how? what is the level of cahanging?
for ex. user wants output voltage as 20V and i will set is as 20V and user can do welding in 20V conditions..so user wants to use electronic choke %25. so will i change very fast level of 20V to where(21,22,23,24,25,26...?)??
i am using ARM Cortex M3 which is very fast.
İ can change voltage levels in microseconds but why and how? what is the level of cahanging?
for ex. user wants output voltage as 20V and i will set is as 20V and user can do welding in 20V conditions..so user wants to use electronic choke %25. so will i change very fast level of 20V to where(21,22,23,24,25,26...?)??
shenion
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As I said, it does not need mechanical control, but it does need circuitry to do it. The Lincoln I had used a rectifier and a simple transistor clamp setup. The pot adjusted the feedback to the transistor. Could be done in software with an electronic pot or a programmable voltage reference.
STT can change the voltage from the welding voltage (20v to so) and ramp up to near 100V or so to maintain the same current as the arc current as the arc forms a ball on the wire. AFAIK it uses a DSP to handle the control and high-speed A/D. It needs to monitor the current and voltage to detect the short/arc period.
Most MIGs do not have variable inductance. If they do it is just 2 settings one for short-arc and one for spray transfer.
STT can change the voltage from the welding voltage (20v to so) and ramp up to near 100V or so to maintain the same current as the arc current as the arc forms a ball on the wire. AFAIK it uses a DSP to handle the control and high-speed A/D. It needs to monitor the current and voltage to detect the short/arc period.
Most MIGs do not have variable inductance. If they do it is just 2 settings one for short-arc and one for spray transfer.
Thank you for your answer..
So you said you should rump up to 100V but my machines output max=55V.
So i can change immediately user referance and i can change output between 10V to 55V.. if user wants 20V, i can set 20V and when user makes welding i can change welding voltaj up to 55V very fast and back to 20V..
I attached picture.. is it true (idea)?..but we have to know frequency of output voltage of oscilattion.i think oscilation frequency is very important but what is the ideal frequency of out put oscilattion?
So you said you should rump up to 100V but my machines output max=55V.
So i can change immediately user referance and i can change output between 10V to 55V.. if user wants 20V, i can set 20V and when user makes welding i can change welding voltaj up to 55V very fast and back to 20V..
I attached picture.. is it true (idea)?..but we have to know frequency of output voltage of oscilattion.i think oscilation frequency is very important but what is the ideal frequency of out put oscilattion?
shenion
Tool Pack Rat
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It is not a fixed frequency, nor a square wave. You need to detect the short-arc frequency and then adjust the voltage to maintain the current. Most use current-mode controllers.
This is something (pulse mode) that major manufacturers took years to get the software right.
Edit: An example of the I/V waveform is here.
This is something (pulse mode) that major manufacturers took years to get the software right.
Edit: An example of the I/V waveform is here.
You can simulate inductance with a gyrator circuit, but it will need a phenomenally powerful amplifier to be useful here. I have only ever seen electronically simulated inductors used in signal processing circuits, where there is no real power requerement. They do not provide any energy storage, unlike a real inductor, instead the energy comes from the DC supplies to the amplifier.
I would use what someone has already described, a real inductor with an auxiliary winding on it which can be fed with controlled DC to vary the saturation of the core. But beware of high energy spikes induced in the control winding. I speak from experience....
I would use what someone has already described, a real inductor with an auxiliary winding on it which can be fed with controlled DC to vary the saturation of the core. But beware of high energy spikes induced in the control winding. I speak from experience....
