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8ob
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If we are talking mini diggers here I will say bucket crowd is more important, no amount of boom lift or dipper arm rake on a minidigger is going to rip out roots on bony old ground but a decent amount of power in the bucket crowd will. A lot less stress on the machine as well.
Bob
Bob
windingroads
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If there is a blade on the digger keep it behind you and lift the digger a little,
then sit the bucket on solid ground in close or vertical,
even with the engine ticking over it should lift the digger into the air,
also monitor how fast all this happens, a slow movement is expected at idle
while at half throttle you should be going pretty fast, try at both throttle positions,
but the faster the better up to a point,
as when diggers get worn some people people adjust the valves to make
them seem to move faster, this is false power, its only a quick take off, a jerk
a bit like changing settings in windows that make everything appear to
bolt onto your screen, processing power however has not changed a bit.
Best to go to a known good machine and try it out as above, then move on to
the one you are buying and do the same,
one key point, make sure you heat the hydraulics up as the hotter they get
the less power they produce when they are worn.
Even you have to hire out the same model digger to get a feel for it from a plant hire
co its worth a days experimenting so you know what to expect.
You could also just have a higher volume bucket ram and add it for when you are
digging roots, but the best option for roots is to make yourself a hydraulic cutting jaw,
bare all the roots, then put on the jaw and cut them out.
It takes a very big digger to pull out roots, and you will still meet roots that
no digger will pull unless you have a diesel drinking monster that will never pay
for its self digging roots, and will most likely sink everywhere you go.
Regards, john
then sit the bucket on solid ground in close or vertical,
even with the engine ticking over it should lift the digger into the air,
also monitor how fast all this happens, a slow movement is expected at idle
while at half throttle you should be going pretty fast, try at both throttle positions,
but the faster the better up to a point,
as when diggers get worn some people people adjust the valves to make
them seem to move faster, this is false power, its only a quick take off, a jerk
a bit like changing settings in windows that make everything appear to
bolt onto your screen, processing power however has not changed a bit.
Best to go to a known good machine and try it out as above, then move on to
the one you are buying and do the same,
one key point, make sure you heat the hydraulics up as the hotter they get
the less power they produce when they are worn.
Even you have to hire out the same model digger to get a feel for it from a plant hire
co its worth a days experimenting so you know what to expect.
You could also just have a higher volume bucket ram and add it for when you are
digging roots, but the best option for roots is to make yourself a hydraulic cutting jaw,
bare all the roots, then put on the jaw and cut them out.
It takes a very big digger to pull out roots, and you will still meet roots that
no digger will pull unless you have a diesel drinking monster that will never pay
for its self digging roots, and will most likely sink everywhere you go.
Regards, john
^^^ Excellent advice ^^^ , the machine should be capable of lifting itself with the engine at idle, the only thing about revving up the engine is that you get more flow not pressure so the machine works faster, if it will only lift itself when revving then you have tired hydraulics because you're using the faster flow to overcome the leakage in the system and allow the pressure to build.
The other think to note is that a slight drop in pressure makes a massive difference to how a machine works, if the system pressure is 240 Bar and you only have 230 you will notice the machine being underpowered, by the time it's down to 220 you'll be slagging the machine off but you've still only lost 10%. It's easy to turn up the pressure regulators on most machines but then the pump/engine becomes the limiting factor and if either of them is tired then don't expect to gain much.
Thanks for the input. The reason I am asking is I am doing the research for my next digger. I usually buy SH about 2 to 3 years old with low hours but as this is probably going to be the last one I think i will go for new. As a matter of note using the test outlined above I think that most of the diggers I have owned it the past would have failed. The only one that would have passed easily was a 2005 SMC 1.5 ton. for a little 1.5 tonner it was awesome - shame the crankshaft snapped at 700 hours. This time I am considering one of those mini back hoe loaders. I have looked at the JCB 1cx but they a based on a skidsteer design - not good on grass. The two Italian makes look interesting Venieri and Palazzani. I was just trying to compare the capabilities of the two machines.
windingroads
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Good points, if it wont turn on damp grass just imagine it in deep muck, probably wouldn't
even track let alone turn.
And you won't need to worry about pulling roots, you will be lucky not to pull it over on
top of yourself.
Bill Edwards
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I'm curious, what do people adjust that makes them seem more responsive?
Pressure relief valve wouldn't do that as that's maximum pressure, so what is it?
I'd be interested to know as well
I have not tried a 1CX (wheels) but I used a 1CXT a few weeks ago - to be fair I found it a nice machine and no sign of being under powered. To be honest it doesn't matter what machine you use (small diggers) you always want more. The problem with the 1CXT is that it has tracks and all machines with tracks rip up grass when maneuvering which tends to make a small job much larger (unless you want to carry sheets of ply around with you). Anyway that's the idea about looking for a small wheeled BH loader.
Lift the front of the machine with the bucket and then slew which ever way you want to turn and operate both the tracks in opposite directions all at the same time, only turn a little at a time and then repeat. Does minimal damage to the ground.
BrianCork
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Have an old 3cx here and have used both 2cx's and 1cx's.. The 1cx really is only a toy and unless you're seriously stuck for space I'd avoid it like the plague, 10 hours in that cab and you'd feel seasick.
With regards small tracked diggers I was pleasantly surprised by a 5 tonne Wacker Neuson I used recently, had a real "proper excavator" feel to it and I'd nearly go so far as to say it was as productive as an 8 tonne machine, everything was so smooth in it.
With regards small tracked diggers I was pleasantly surprised by a 5 tonne Wacker Neuson I used recently, had a real "proper excavator" feel to it and I'd nearly go so far as to say it was as productive as an 8 tonne machine, everything was so smooth in it.
useing the croud on the bucket to leaver up roots stumps and concrete will just bend the ram chrome.
for pressures if you low on power turning up the relief valves dosent help. if you notice it wont lift something at fast idel but will when its mid revs the pumps are getting tired. you'll often find they'll lift a bit more when reved out but thats due to flow limitationns of the relief valve letting the system pressure rise a bit.
personaly i find wheeled machenes make a mess, lifting the machene with the bucket so it's on the tips of the tracks you can spin them round whilst slewing and make much less mess.
here i've got an old 2.7 T atm it looks rough as hell but packs a supriseing punch. but thats more due to haveing a diffrent motor and larger displacement iron cased tandem pumps, 1 stage for the machene and the other for the pecker lines and running at 350 bar
for pressures if you low on power turning up the relief valves dosent help. if you notice it wont lift something at fast idel but will when its mid revs the pumps are getting tired. you'll often find they'll lift a bit more when reved out but thats due to flow limitationns of the relief valve letting the system pressure rise a bit.
personaly i find wheeled machenes make a mess, lifting the machene with the bucket so it's on the tips of the tracks you can spin them round whilst slewing and make much less mess.
here i've got an old 2.7 T atm it looks rough as hell but packs a supriseing punch. but thats more due to haveing a diffrent motor and larger displacement iron cased tandem pumps, 1 stage for the machene and the other for the pecker lines and running at 350 bar
