Converting a vertical bandsaw for metal cutting

[astro_al]

Hi guys, I need a vertical bandsaw for chopping up some stainless.

I need it pretty pronto, and I have virtually no budget!

Phoning around to see if anyone has any old pile of crap at the back of the showroom they need shifted didn't reveal much. One lead is an old Dominion wood working bandsaw.

I figure at least old style machines (even woodworking ones) have the required structure / weight. It'd need regearing by either an extra pulley or maybe an electronic speed control. Anything else need changing (apart from the blade?).

I'd appreciate opinions on how successfully this will chop stainless.

Or if anyone knows of a knackered Do All / Startrite / Midsaw etc lying in some grass somewhere, please let me know. I can collect anythng from anywhere if it fits the bill.

Here is the saw - thoughts???

Cheers, Al.

 

[the artfull-codger]

sorry I can't help you out with a bandsaw, but the problem you will find is that wood saws cut at a higher speed than metal cutting saws, & I find both machining & drilling stainless,(depending on the grade) you need a slower cut & more force, ie don't let it rub or it'll work harden, keep it cutting preferebly with ''rocol'' or similar cutting compound.


slan go fol

 

[Sam]

sorry I can't help you out with a bandsaw, but the problem you will find is that wood saws cut at a higher speed than metal cutting saws, & I find both machining & drilling stainless,(depending on the grade) you need a slower cut & more force, ie don't let it rub or it'll work harden, keep it cutting preferebly with ''rocol'' or similar cutting compound.


slan go fol

I will second that one, I bought a wood working saw years ago and found the cut speed was too high and that was for mild steel.

 

[MrFluffy]

Slow it down to the right sfm for the blade/ stainless with your mentioned gearing system (it'll have to be compounded with the original drivetrain somehow to get a sufficient reduction to go from wood to stainless, I doubt a vfd would give you sufficient speed reduction without loss of torque) and swap the blade.
As its old there looks to be lots of rigidity in the frame, you can retrofit a precision roller blade guide if the blade guide isnt up to it.

Ive been searching for a old bandsaw to convert the same for some time now. I have a modern one and the construction is far far too lightweight for heavy work, but a old cast iron monster...

 

[eil]

For whats it worth, a butcher customer of mine had a big old bandsaw which he unfortunately sold it was a proper meat cutting one with a sliding table on it about the size of the one in your pic, that would have done a good steel or wood one as there was enough room underneath to add more than one pulley, just another type for you to keep your eye out for.

 

[brookie456]

Hi Al,

Get the speed right on that, you can cut what you like! Lovely old machine, if you don't want it...

 

[astro_al]

I've been digging on t'net.

Seems Fluffy is right - a VFD with sufficient reduction to get down from a wood cutting saw speed to a stainless cutting speed would have bog all torque. Looks like I need a worm drive or a multi-belt setup (though I think it'll be prone to slipping).

...Or a lottery win.

Brookie - I'm inclined to agree, its really just the size of the vertical post that could be an issue. Metal saws always seem much beefier around the post, but then its usually a sheetmetal cover / case, so it doesn't really tell you much about the structure inside.

I think I'd need to add some swarf-wiping-wheels to clean the blade under the table before it goes back around the main wheel/roller at the bottom, but thats do-able.

Ta, Al.

 

[brookie456]

Al, you are a genuine contender

If you can do the gearing without losing the torque, the machine is more than capable, the old Dominion machinery is second to none. No worries over the strength of the machine, unless you're up to around +++50.00mm (without knowing the machine specs), a saw like that would cost £3 figures now. As before, more thanh appy to take it

 

[chap]

Maybe some guarding so it doesn't chew your toes off?!

 

[astro_al]

Yeah - its not my toes I'm worried about!!!

Al.

 

[chap]

Christ! Your todger must hang long and low!

 

[astro_al]

Nah, short legs...

 

[chap]

lol

 

[R Kraft]

Have you thought about friction cutting ?
Stainless should cut well.
I saw someone cut off a file with the back of a wood blade.
http://yarchive.net/metal/friction_cutting.html

Robert

 

[Pete.]

Taken from This Thread. There's aotherfurther down the page that shows a horizontal bandsaw converted to vertical.

Vertical bandsaw for both metal and wood cutting. Done this years ago and have been happy with it. Have had no problems with it.

The standard speed motor for wood cutting drives the bandsaw so turning this motor on gives high speed for wood, plastic, aluminum and sometimes brass cutting.

There is a second motor. It is a treadmill motor that has a 28 to one gear reducer grafted onto it. The output of this is grafted onto a bicycle freewheel. So the treadmill motor drives the larger wood cutting motor but the larger wood cutting motor can't drive the geared down motor because of the one way action of the bicycle freewheel.



The teadmill motor has a variable speed control and the wood cutting has step pulleys for speed change if needed.

The back of the bandsaw showes two pulleys that are used for a digital tac. With a little math the sizes of the pulleys and number of sensors of the tac pickup is figured so the tac will show direct readings of feet per minute of blade speed.

Also shown on the panel is a switch for a small aquarium type air compressor that blows air on the cut line to clear chips.

 

[Shox Dr]

Al have a look on eblag, I have a Company bookmarkedfor gear reduction boxes going for a song. I just looked and cannot find them, the reason been the listing was a bit off topic. I keep looking but found these meanwhile

1.2KW Cap. GEAR BOX with 1:36.4 RATIO - Running In Oil

and

1KW Cap. GEAR BOX with 1:18 RATIO - Running In Oil



There's also this guy, I bought a 12amp VFD for peanuts last yr, only lives 15 miles from me, very nice to deal with, give him a call he has loads of stuff, that is not listed, might even have/know of a bands saw

 

[astro_al]

Right, been busy on this. Panic over. I was just about to drop a fistful on that Dominion, when a Startrite 20RWS came along for very little extra! Lucky me - normally this sort of thing happens after I've put my money down!

I had a good old chat with the folks at Startrite to check it was suitable - what a great company, every time I speak to them I'm pleasantly surprised at how upbeat & helpful they are. Got all parts in stock - in his words 'we could build entire new machines if someone fabricated the frame, and even getting that done isn't out of the question' - now that's support for your old products!

Had a discussion about their nomenclature, the guys said he'd try to write a PDF of the naming conventions and stick it on the site under 'spares' - how cool is that?

Anyway, in case it ever helps anyone here are a few of the definitions:

'##' - the numbers indicate the throat depth in inches (width measurement between blade and 'structure' of saw).

R = 'Rapier' (sorry, forgot to ask the meaning - presumably just a series/family of saws)?
W = indicates the machine has a blade Welder.
F = Fixed table.
T = Tilting table.
S = Sliding table.
H = Hydraulic feed table.

So my acquisition - a 20 RWS has a 20" throat depth, is a 'Rapier', has a blade welder and has a sliding table. The table also tilts, so I guess the denomination 'S' also includes 'T'. Not sure if thats always the case.

In case anyone is in doubt, they also confirmed that blade welding is only intended to facilitate cutting out internal shapes, not as a way to create replacement blades - although it may work for this, their opinion is that its impossible to generate the consistency and reliability of 'production' blade welds using a human armed with a blade welder.

Hope this info helps someone.

Cheers, Al.

 

[dopplershift]

1.2KW Cap. GEAR BOX with 1:36.4 RATIO - Running In Oil

and

1KW Cap. GEAR BOX with 1:18 RATIO - Running In Oil

Phwoar!!! They look absolutely brilliant! Almost definitely be able to handle alot more than 1kW too. If I was in the UK I'd snap those two up immediately.

Interesting to note that they look like they're exactly the same product, except that the 1:18 box has the small pulley on the input shaft to halve the ratio. Meaning you could buy the 1:18 box, then choose later if 1:18 or 1:36 was the best ratio for you. Or you could buy both, take the small pulley off and use them as a matched pair of 1:36's!

Awesome!

Oh, and congratulations on your find Al! Sounds pretty sweet.

 

[astro_al]

Brookie - do you want me to put you in touch with the guy who has the Dominion saw?

Ta for everyone's input. One day I'll test out that fascinating friction sawing thing - love to see that in action.

Al.

 

[brookie456]

Brookie - do you want me to put you in touch with the guy who has the Dominion saw?

Ta for everyone's input. One day I'll test out that fascinating friction sawing thing - love to see that in action.

Al.

Hi Al,

Thanks for thinking about me, but the Portamig arrived today Got many chores to go before the Brownie points allow another purchase Congratulations on the Startrite, as good as it gets saw wise.

Best regards
Iain