2k solid or direct gloss

[Colinbuckley]

Hi all, I have an old vw transporter (1999) that needs some of the paint work patching up, what I am wondering is do I use a 2k solid which would be the original paint or could I use a direct gloss.
Many thanks Colin.

 

[MetalMonkey]

I think you are confusing the terms slightly.

2K is a system that has two components - the paint and the activator.

It is available in a range of colours and where it is a single stage product that is both the colour and the final coat, it is called direct gloss.

Alternatively, you can use basecoat/clearcoat, where a separate basecoat (which provides the colour) is used with a clear 2K laquer over the top to add the protection.
Both of those are 2K systems.

Solid colour just means it isn't a metallic or pearl, you can have that in both systems.
However when a lot of people say solid colour they are using it as another name for direct gloss.

 

[Colinbuckley]

Ok, that makes sense, but i thought the paint was mixed with the hardener ie 2:1 and painted and that was the finish with no clear coat.

 

[ajlelectronics]

Ok, that makes sense, but i thought the paint was mixed with the hardener ie 2:1 and painted and that was the finish with no clear coat.

Yes as has just been explained above. 2K means zwei komponent which tells you nothing apart from the fact that it has two components. Many 2K paints contain Isocyanates, some , like epoxy primer do not.

You can have a "solid colour" paint, which is paint without metallic or pearl additions in any formulation, acrylic or cellulose based. That has no bearing on it being 2K or not. The other option is a solid colour basecoat, either solvent or water base and then overcoat it quickly with a 2K (or even a 1K) clear lacquer.

 

[MetalMonkey]

Ok, that makes sense, but i thought the paint was mixed with the hardener ie 2:1 and painted and that was the finish with no clear coat.

That would be a solid direct gloss 2K paint.


If you wanted to use 2K clearcoat (which is mixed with hardener) you would typically put that over a separate coloured basecoat (which is usually just a 1 component paint with no activator.)

To confuse things even further you can actually put clearcoat over direct gloss, and mix basecoat into the clearcoat - but that is not typical uses for it.

I'm not sure how familiar you are with spray painting, but patching up paintwork is usually considerably harder than respraying the entire thing - unless you really don't care about matching the colour or finish.
2K paints, while very durable are also very toxic to spray as they mostly contain isocyanates - and therefore need specialist equipment to do it safely.

If you are just after a quick touch up and don't care what it looks like, you might actually be better off rollering it on and then just sanding and polishing it up as that would avoid you inhaling the airborne spray.
Not suitable if you want a nice job, but if you are just after a durable finish its an option.

 

[Colinbuckley]

The van doesn’t have a clear coat, so I guess the direct gloss is the way to go.

 

[RaceDiagnostics]

The van doesn’t have a clear coat, so I guess the direct gloss is the way to go.

That will be a 2K direct gloss then? Or do you plan to use cellulose?

 

[Colinbuckley]

2k gloss I think, can you recommend a brand or supplier preferably on line, will be a job for the summer (outside) hopefully

 

[qwakers]

it would be illegal and dangerous to paint 2k direct gloss without the correct facilities.

 

[keithski122]

it would be illegal and dangerous to paint 2k direct gloss without the correct facilities.

I'm not sure that’s correct, inadvisable but not illegal.

 

[ajlelectronics]

I'm not sure that’s correct, inadvisable but not illegal.

I believe that HSE prosecute under Criminal law, but I'm not certain. I would imagine that @Parm could wax lyrical?

 

[RaceDiagnostics]

2k spraying takes a bit of investment to do it safely, just do a bit of research. Here is my setup. It helps if you are not in a built up area where you may bother neighbours, if a neighbour complains to the council they'll likely come round and give you talking to at least.

 

[minimutly]

Loads of stuff on here about it - essentially you need an air fed mask, oil free air that means you don't breath the isocyanite.
Alternatively you could do it outside with a suitable filter mask....

 

[charlysays]

Unless you have air fed breathing apparatus and don't have neighbours nearby I would contact HMG and see if they can mix you up a batch of Nisocoat 2 direct gloss. Use epoxy primer for your primer (e.g lechler 29107). HMG marketing material says they can mix nisocoat 2 up in fleet and automotive colours so get the paint code (VW should be able to tell you from the chassis number). Nisocoat 2 is an isocyanate free 2k paint with similar performance to isocyanate paints. It uses epoxide hardeners but still manages to attain excellent weather resistance (I did my daily car in it several years ago and it's still mirror glossy despite no polishing, just the occasional wash and out in all weathers 24/7).

My advice would be to work on a few panels at a time, get them straight, rust free and coated in epoxy primer. If you can't keep the work environment warm ish and dry then use materials which won't absorb moisture (e.g epoxy primer and potentially epoxy filler although dinitrol alusoft claims to be non porous). You can then top coat the panels bit by bit (don't try to topcoat the whole van in one go as you'll end up with runs and orange peel). I found dry flatting the primer to 800 grit worked well.

 

[ajlelectronics]

Unless you have air fed breathing apparatus and don't have neighbours nearby I would contact HMG and see if they can mix you up a batch of Nisocoat 2 direct gloss. Use epoxy primer for your primer (e.g lechler 29107). HMG marketing material says they can mix nisocoat 2 up in fleet and automotive colours so get the paint code (VW should be able to tell you from the chassis number). Nisocoat 2 is an isocyanate free 2k paint with similar performance to isocyanate paints. It uses epoxide hardeners but still manages to attain excellent weather resistance (I did my daily car in it several years ago and it's still mirror glossy despite no polishing, just the occasional wash and out in all weathers 24/7).

My advice would be to work on a few panels at a time, get them straight, rust free and coated in epoxy primer. If you can't keep the work environment warm ish and dry then use materials which won't absorb moisture (e.g epoxy primer and potentially epoxy filler although dinitrol alusoft claims to be non porous). You can then top coat the panels bit by bit (don't try to topcoat the whole van in one go as you'll end up with runs and orange peel). I found dry flatting the primer to 800 grit worked well.

Bear in mind that automotive epoxy primers want a minimum temperature of 15C to cure properly. You could use IR heaters if you don't have a warm environment to paint in.

 

[charlysays]

Bear in mind that automotive epoxy primers want a minimum temperature of 15C to cure properly. You could use IR heaters if you don't have a warm environment to paint in.

True. Patio heaters and an IR thermometer to monitor panel temps are great for the occasional DIYer.