Asbestos - or is it?

[ibrooks]

Anyone know if it's possible to tell without special equipment?

It's the old roof from my garage. I replaced it with a wooden one and the corrugated sheets are sat in my back garden awaiting disposal. In the meantime the next door neighbour had their garage dismantled and replaced and their "builder" took their roof away with them. I didn't get chance to speak to the "builder" (possibly as well as I have some issues with what they did with the party wall of the garages) but the neighbour said that they told him the roof wasn't asbestos and they just sent it for hardcore.

Now as it happens I'll need some hardcore for something I want to do so can I just smash the corrugated stuff I have up and drop it in a hole? I know I could maybe get away with doing it whether it's asbestos or not but if it is I'd prefer to dispose of it properly.

Iain

 

[Rig Pig]

Anything old is almost certainly asbestos, it's much better to be safe than sorry and just double bag it up and dispose of it properly. Cowboy builders have decidedly dodgy ways of sorting out asbestos!

You can take samples and send them to a lab for analysis, but for small amounts it's probably as cheap to pay the disposal fee if your tip charge for asbestos.

 

[Parm]

It's most likely to be asbestos cement sheeting that contains chrysotile asbestos. The rules on asbestos cement have been relaxed a little recently.

Spray with a dilute pva solution and contact local council. They should have a faculty where you can drop sheets off without paying

 

[Pete.]

Anyone know if it's possible to tell without special equipment?

It's the old roof from my garage. I replaced it with a wooden one and the corrugated sheets are sat in my back garden awaiting disposal. In the meantime the next door neighbour had their garage dismantled and replaced and their "builder" took their roof away with them. I didn't get chance to speak to the "builder" (possibly as well as I have some issues with what they did with the party wall of the garages) but the neighbour said that they told him the roof wasn't asbestos and they just sent it for hardcore.

Now as it happens I'll need some hardcore for something I want to do so can I just smash the corrugated stuff I have up and drop it in a hole? I know I could maybe get away with doing it whether it's asbestos or not but if it is I'd prefer to dispose of it properly.

Iain

Asbestos regs only cover commercial situations if you have it in a domestic setting there's no restriction on how you handle it. I would be very sure not to leave anyone else at risk of exposure though. Roofing sheets are almost always low-grade chrysotile but it's not for certain, it could contain any or all types.

 

[roofman]

when you bag it spray it with water on all sides as your working...keeps the dust to almost zero limits

 

[mike os]

If pre 1980 almost certainly contains asbestos, type is hard to determine so treat with caution. Your council may do a free or low price collection

 

[brightspark]

Asbestos regs only cover commercial situations if you have it in a domestic setting there's no restriction on how you handle it. I would be very sure not to leave anyone else at risk of exposure though. Roofing sheets are almost always low-grade chrysotile but it's not for certain, it could contain any or all types.

asbestos regs cover household domestic propertys as well if u get builders in they have to risk asess any early artex asbestos packings under joists that are exposed and certain lino tiles and asbestos roof tiles and soffits have to be professionaly removed . joe public can do whatever he likes removing it in his own home though ive been stopped from working in fire damaged houses by the councill and insurance companys till its been cleared and safe to work

 

[Parm]

Asbestos regs only cover commercial situations if you have it in a domestic setting there's no restriction on how you handle it. I would be very sure not to leave anyone else at risk of exposure though. Roofing sheets are almost always low-grade chrysotile but it's not for certain, it could contain any or all types.

This is very very poor advice indeed and in fact down right dangerous!!!!!

It is incorrect that the asbestos do not regs cover domestic dwellings, but the H&S consultancy I work for have a huge team of surveyors inspecting asbestos in council housing stock. Any builder undertaking works has a very clear duty to understand asbestos risk, instruct a refurbishment and demolition survey and take appropriate action as advised using appropriately licensed contractors.

Also there is no such thing as low grade asbestos, all three common forms, chrysotile, crocidolite and amosite are just as dangerous as each other and just as capable of causing, asbestosis, lung cancer and mesothelioma.

Asbestos cement, which is the most likely suspect in the case of the OP most often contains chrysotile but I have seen it with a mixture of all three. The rules regarding bonded or cement based products have been relaxed a little due to the fact that it contains less than 1% asbestos. Even then these relaxed rules only apply if sheets come off whole and there is no risk of breaking which may give rise friable asbestos fibres that can be inhaled.

If anyone is planning to remove and dispose cement sheets them my advice is to wear a disposable paper suits, disposable respirator that can provide protection to P3 level. Thoroughly wet sheets with a PVA solution applied from a sprayer and wrap sheets in strong plastic in preparation for disposal. All local authorities will have an asbestos skip where you can dump these sheets free of charge.

Asbestos related diseases are in the increase from exposure that has occured years ago as it has a latency period of around 40 years. Even today around 20 tradespersons are diagnosed every week with an asbestos related illness which very sadly has a terminal outcome.

Just to give you an idea and depending on the type of house you live in, when it was constructed you can find asbestos fibre board (very dangerous as fibres are extremely friable) on soffits, eaves panels, linings to boiler cupboards and bonded materials in toilet cisters, cement sheets, window fills, floor tiles, roof tiles

I have worked very closely with this industry for over 20 years and seen it all!!!

 

[the snooper]

my son is a commercial floorer and if he gets a job in a house (which is rare) and it has old floor tiles they are not allowed to remove them, they have to be tested and an asbestos removal company takes them up, if they contain asbestos

 

[Shox Dr]

I lived in a building (aka shed) clad inside and out, for 5yrs while my father built a house next door. When I was a kid. Played with it as well, as he built the shed

 

[the snooper]

I lived in a building (aka shed) clad inside and out, for 5yrs while my father built a house next door. When I was a kid. Played with it as well, as he built the shed

nasty, have you had any tests ? could be a ticking time bomb, hope not for your sake

 

[brightspark]

I lived in a building (aka shed) clad inside and out, for 5yrs while my father built a house next door. When I was a kid. Played with it as well, as he built the shed

didnt we all i worked in an old factory when i was an apprentice and they built a sprayroom and paint store out of asbestos sheets and cut them all up with a stihlsaw near us we were covered in dust it must be luck of the draw if u get cancer as im 60 and my breathing is in good health

 

[Rocketman]

This is very very poor advice indeed and in fact down right dangerous!!!!!

It is incorrect that the asbestos do not regs cover domestic dwellings, but the H&S consultancy I work for have a huge team of surveyors inspecting asbestos in council housing stock. Any builder undertaking works has a very clear duty to understand asbestos risk, instruct a refurbishment and demolition survey and take appropriate action as advised using appropriately licensed contractors.

Also there is no such thing as low grade asbestos, all three common forms, chrysotile, crocidolite and amosite are just as dangerous as each other and just as capable of causing, asbestosis, lung cancer and mesothelioma.

Asbestos cement, which is the most likely suspect in the case of the OP most often contains chrysotile but I have seen it with a mixture of all three. The rules regarding bonded or cement based products have been relaxed a little due to the fact that it contains less than 1% asbestos. Even then these relaxed rules only apply if sheets come off whole and there is no risk of breaking which may give rise friable asbestos fibres that can be inhaled.

If anyone is planning to remove and dispose cement sheets them my advice is to wear a disposable paper suits, disposable respirator that can provide protection to P3 level. Thoroughly wet sheets with a PVA solution applied from a sprayer and wrap sheets in strong plastic in preparation for disposal. All local authorities will have an asbestos skip where you can dump these sheets free of charge.

Asbestos related diseases are in the increase from exposure that has occured years ago as it has a latency period of around 40 years. Even today around 20 tradespersons are diagnosed every week with an asbestos related illness which very sadly has a terminal outcome.

Just to give you an idea and depending on the type of house you live in, when it was constructed you can find asbestos fibre board (very dangerous as fibres are extremely friable) on soffits, eaves panels, linings to boiler cupboards and bonded materials in toilet cisters, cement sheets, window fills, floor tiles, roof tiles

I have worked very closely with this industry for over 20 years and seen it all!!!

Great write up. The only thing I would disagree slightly is the danger of different types. While yes they all are very bad there is reasonable evidence that exposure to certain types are more likely to cause long term effects like asbestosis.

didnt we all i worked in an old factory when i was an apprentice and they built a sprayroom and paint store out of asbestos sheets and cut them all up with a stihlsaw near us we were covered in dust it must be luck of the draw if u get cancer as im 60 and my breathing is in good health

Brightspark while cancer is more likely the most likely first outcome will be to develop asbestosis. My father had this, he had complained about pain in the lungs for sometime. Went for the xray and there was the bad news.

 

[Shox Dr]

BS. Snoop. Not had any tests, and dont suffer from any respitory problems, the old man is 80 in April, fit and well

 

[Parm]

Great write up. The only thing I would disagree slightly is the danger of different types. While yes they all are very bad there is reasonable evidence that exposure to certain types are more likely to cause long term effects like asbestosis.



Brightspark while cancer is more likely the most likely first outcome will be to develop asbestosis. My father had this, he had complained about pain in the lungs for sometime. Went for the xray and there was the bad news.

Rocketman, if we're gonna split hairs crocidolite or blue asbestos is scientifically proven to be the most dangerous, however as they all cause cancer we in the professional H&S world make no differentiation between the three

 

[Kent]

Its horrible stuff, I have a roof to remove myself and not looking forwards to it. I shall be taking all precautions (not been told of the PVA before but I shall use it thanks) because I do know guys in the building trade that died from it (one quite young in his 30s). I also had a customer (an old lady) who spent a stack of money with me renovating her home and garden she was the last survivor of the family lost her husband then all her kids after living near an asbestos plant in Africa, cant imagine that sort of loss. Not sure if she knew or not but within 18mnths of doing all the work she also passed.

 

[Welderpaul]

I did an UKATA asbestos awareness course not long ago, HSE push for anyone working on refurb jobs to have at least recognised awareness training. Its amazing how many products is was used it, and only recently (relatively speaking) stopped being used. Our lads have found it on a few jobs over the years.

 

[brightspark]

old boiler and pipe lagging is the worst if it gets damaged

 

[Parm]

Its horrible stuff, I have a roof to remove myself and not looking forwards to it. I shall be taking all precautions (not been told of the PVA before but I shall use it thanks) because I do know guys in the building trade that died from it (one quite young in his 30s). I also had a customer (an old lady) who spent a stack of money with me renovating her home and garden she was the last survivor of the family lost her husband then all her kids after living near an asbestos plant in Africa, cant imagine that sort of loss. Not sure if she knew or not but within 18mnths of doing all the work she also passed.

The reason we recommend PVA is that it's damp but when dried it bonds the fibres to the substrate. Water is also good, but when it dries out your back to square one. Also important that it's sprayed because brushing it on will relase fibres that have the potential to become airborne and thus inhalable..

Shoul add that spray should be the pump up type and not fed of a compressor

Screwfix/Toolstation do a cheapie 5l PVA which is good enough for this.

 

[Parm]

old boiler and pipe lagging is the worst if it gets damaged

This is called monkey dung, raw asbestos fibres that are covered with a plaster of Paris type coating. When this deteriorates or is broken this give rise to huge amount of fibres, second only to spray coating found on structural steel work

I've seen an entire Marks and Spencer store near Glasgow being quarantined, all stock, fixtures an fittings were contaminated cause someone removed some pipe insulation without the proper precautions. Whole lot was disposed under controlled conditions as contaminated waste. It cost the plumbing contractor doing the original work just over 2 million quid about 12 years ago. I was the expert witness