Car auto boxes

[zzr1200]

I've just got to overcome 30+ years of driving manuals

Also it's keyless entry/starting and I'm still scrabbling round the steering column trying to take the key out.

I wouldn't buy a vehicle with an automatic gearbox, I've driven them and had to rebuild them.

I prefer being able to decide when and if I want to change gear.

If you want keyless ignition buy an old mini a hair, clip will do or anything else you like......

 

[Robotstar5]

Mrs Robo's had auto's for a few years, so I thought I'd try one, certainly found it nicer to drive in heavy stop/start traffic instead of holding a hydraulic clutch down.

 

[MCKDAVID]

worked abroad for many years, with rental cars, long and short term, most of them were automatic, presumably because that's what their market desired. I kinda of got used to them. Like them well enough, but for me if it's a family / work type car, with a lot of town, or city driving then auto every time, but anything resembling sporty give me a manual every time.
As for how to use them, the torque convertors were obviously designed to slip, so I always left them in drive and let them do exactly that, only if I was there a good while, would I kick it into neutral to save them over heating, but normally just left them in drive..

I can now live with the electronic keys, and push button starts, but what I can't get used to is these electronic hand brakes, just don't like them at all...

 

[zzr1200]

I can now live with the electronic keys, and push button starts, but what I can't get used to is these electronic hand brakes, just don't like them at all...

They just don't tend to work every well on handbrake turn/slides do they.....

 

[Robotstar5]

They just don't tend to work every well on handbrake turn/slides do they.....

Handbrakes don't seem as good these days, I could turn my Mini's and Metro's a treat, although the MOT man did struggle with the flyoff handbrake I had on one Mini

 

[Benthosboy]

I'm quite staggered these days by how many people sit at red lights with their foot on the brake pedal. What ever happened to selecting neutral and applying the parking brake? If I had a pound for every one of the "foot on the brake" brigade who've started to roll back towards me whilst sat on an incline, I'd have a lot of money!!

And from a purely financial angle, what's the point sitting with an auto in drive while you wait for the green light? More so these days when lights seem to stay red for an overly long time, all that's happening is the engine is needlessly working just that bit harder for no valid reason. Still, if people have money to waste....

 

[MCKDAVID]

They just don't tend to work every well on handbrake turn/slides do they.....

no comment.....

as for wasting fuel, well you might be right, but just how much harder do you think it's actually working, the engine drops to idle same as neutral. The only difference would be it's still turning the convertor through the viscosity of the oil, not going to argue it will use more fuel, that's fairly obvious, but in the grand scale of things, I think it would be minor. Besides which it's well know that automatics use more fuel than it's manual counterpart anyway.

 

[zzr1200]

I'm quite staggered these days by how many people sit at red lights with their foot on the brake pedal. What ever happened to selecting neutral and applying the parking brake? If I had a pound for every one of the "foot on the brake" brigade who've started to roll back towards me whilst sat on an incline, I'd have a lot of money!!

So these drivers that rolled back must have had manual gearboxes, because we all know that auto's don't roll back do they and manuals don't have torque converter drag either.

Also these drivers must also be saving money by NOT OPERATING the hand brake system (which causes) mechanical wear to the handbrake linkages, being as brake fluid is a form of oil, is self lubricating and free from resistance/wear...

And from a purely financial angle, what's the point sitting with an auto in drive while you wait for the green light? More so these days when lights seem to stay red for an overly long time, all that's happening is the engine is needlessly working just that bit harder for no valid reason. Still, if people have money to waste....

The fuel consumption drag of a converter is minute compared to a over enthusiastic application of the right foot on either a manual or automatic gearbox from a stand still.....

 

[Bill Edwards]

And from a purely financial angle, what's the point sitting with an auto in drive while you wait for the green light? More so these days when lights seem to stay red for an overly long time, all that's happening is the engine is needlessly working just that bit harder for no valid reason. Still, if people have money to waste....

Have you missed a few previous posts? Specifically, the ones that point out that in modern autos there won't be any measurable difference in fuel economy, and the ones that speak of the wear and tear caused by changing from D to N? An immeasurable quantity of extra fuel burned is going to be much cheaper than replacing a failed auto box.

 

[ajlelectronics]

Oh Bill, you are a comedian sometimes. A failed box? For using it? Regardless of your other comments about it, there is a road safety issue, which is probably the main problem. Sitting at lights or in traffic that is backed up, needs any transmission in park or neutral. Holding it on the brakes is a) irritating to traffic sitting behind and b) dangerous to the vehicle in front if your brake is released for whatever reason.

 

[zzr1200]

there is a road safety issue, which is probably the main problem. Sitting at lights or in traffic that is backed up, needs any transmission in park or neutral. Holding it on the brakes is a) irritating to traffic sitting behind and b) dangerous to the vehicle in front if your brake is released for whatever reason.

Just one question regarding the above statement:

How do you advise a rider to control a motorbike on a steep hill then,

a: if you don't hold it on the brakes (no handbrake..) or ride the clutch in gear (facing uphill),

or

b: scooters don't have neutral and have a form of torque converter plus a constantly engaged drive system...

just pointing out,....some rules for some but not others.......

 

[Bill Edwards]

Oh Bill, you are a comedian sometimes. A failed box? For using it? No, for abusing it. Regardless of your other comments about it, there is a road safety issue, which is probably the main problem. Sitting at lights or in traffic that is backed up, needs any transmission in park or neutral. Holding it on the brakes is a) irritating to traffic sitting behind Use the parking brake if you wish, or stop worrying about doing what nearly all other road users do and b) dangerous to the vehicle in front if your brake is released for whatever reason.

If your brake is released for whatever reason? Now I'm actually worried. Are you really suggesting that the same brakes I trust to be able to stop me from 70 mph if an emergency arose are not to be trusted to keep a car stationery while sat in traffic?

 

[hotrodder]

This thread is almost as comical as 'driving an auto' on car forums
Might not apply to some of the latest stuff where electronics rule (drive by wire etc) but in general i would have thought fuel consumption at idle will be virtually the same regardless of whether it's in gear or not... engine idling = throttle shut, shift into gear and the rpm drops a little due to the drag from the torque converter

The ROSPA have this to say on how automatics should be used... http://www.rospa.com/roadsafety/adviceandinformation/driving/automatic-gearboxes.aspx Like most car owners manuals they claim that more wear happens by shifting into neutral, personally i reckon that's fairly irrelevant i.e. it's like saying that taking a bucket of water from the ocean causes the sea level to drop. Technically it's true but it's of no real significance... old fashioned slushboxes are generally rugged old things that'll put up with all sorts as long as the atf and filter aren't neglected. I've driven more manuals with worn/knackered syncros than i have autos that slip or flare when changing up etc and the few times i've owned an auto that's developed a problem it's always been something on the engine side like a vacuum problem not the box itself.
Modern stuff with lock up torque converters and leccy control not so much but it's generally the leccy stuff that goes wrong or something completely unrelated that puts the box into a limp mode and gets missed so a perfectly good gearbox gets sent off for repair. I used to do quite a lot of work for several gearbox reconditioners (cracked cases etc) and while they obviously rebuilt a lot more manuals than autos simply because more cars are manual their automatic guy had a background in electronics and spent more time troubleshooting leccy stuff than replacing valves and brake bands...

 

[Robotstar5]

Thanks for the link HR

 

[CompoSimmonite]

The torque converter is attached to the engine so the outer casing is rotating all the time it's running. The inner vane is the part that is connected to the auto gearbox. If the engine tickover is too high then you get "creep" as the fluid in the torque converter is moving at such a rate as to "grab" the inner vane and move that as well.
So simple test. If you take an auto to a flat carpark or other open space then select drive but don't apply hand or foot brake you can check if your vehicle "creeps". If not then it's not going to make one any difference whether neutral selected or kept in drive when stationary. If however the vehicle does creep then it shows there is enough power transferred by the fluid in the torque converter to move the inner vane and holding on brake will "waste" this power. How much wasted power I have no idea as I always keep drive selected

Paul h

BTW I also have an automatic motorbike - 1979 Honda CB400A Hondamatic. It has two speeds you manually select depending on riding conditions. Normally I just select high unless very hilly area (I live at base of Peak District) as it has a fluid torque converter that take the place of traditional gears or CVT. Honda also made a CB750A Hondamatic but that had a gearbox that auto changed along the lines of a car.

 

[zx9]

I've just got to overcome 30+ years of driving manuals

..................

On the few occasions that I have borrowed autos it always gets exciting. The 'I am slowing down in traffic, must change down' thought that precedes using the left foot on the brake in attempt to find a phantom clutch.

 

[ajlelectronics]

The advice for newbies to automatics is to keep the left foot tucked under the seat!

I remember my first automatic Granada. I was three pointing on a steep hill in Birmingham after picking up new girlfriend. All going well until I instinctively went for clutch and brake with both feet and almost launched her through the windscreen!

 

[SiPMerlin150]

I like to knock it into N whilst stationary, purely because you can feel the transmission wanting to push the car forward, so something must be slipping to allow the power to waste away when just stationary. First gear are normally the clutch packs as well as second gear, and whilst 3rd and 4th are band clutches.

 

[Shox Dr]

BTW I also have an automatic motorbike - 1979 Honda CB400A Hondamatic. It has two speeds you manually select depending on riding conditions. Normally I just select high unless very hilly area (I live at base of Peak District) as it has a fluid torque converter that take the place of traditional gears or CVT. Honda also made a CB750A Hondamatic but that had a gearbox that auto changed along the lines of a car.

I saw a 750 in Pocklington a few weeks ago, never seen one before.

 

[dannyp]

a bit of stick and getting them hot ( not overheated ) ive found a few times to really help an autobox.

fixed a jag by accident on the way up to the auctions where it would have probaly sold for 50p as it was driveing like a dog but decided to have a play with it on the way. a lot of left foot brakeing was done and a lot of ful throttel in attemps to get the old bardge sideways and to leave 11's up the road ended up turning round and driveing back as it fixed itself
elderly relatives 1.0 micra was behaveing in simalr manner after an oil change and me driveing it for a week it fixed itself.

i recon a lot of autos are actualy driven to gently with probaly lots of silly short runs so the boxes are never given any real power to transmit hene are allways running cold