Just fitted a new one on my 140k miles 2.2 ford engined citroen relay van. The chap at the garage who read the fault codes said its unusual for them to last that long. On his recommendation I took the inlet manifold off to clean it. The ports were around 50% blocked with soot. The key to an efficient engine is getting the air in and exhaust gas out as freely as possible. So why have we got this valves.
- Thread starter Bornfree
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EGR reduces the available oxygen which reduces the burn temperature and prevents the production of NOx.
NOx is one of the exhaust gas components which is proven to be detrimental to human health (IIRC it's one that was suspected to be a major contributor to cot death), which is why it's been a top target for emission reduction.
NOx is one of the exhaust gas components which is proven to be detrimental to human health (IIRC it's one that was suspected to be a major contributor to cot death), which is why it's been a top target for emission reduction.
The Ford 2.5di engine in my 23yo LDV Convoy was the same. The banana-shaped inlet manifold was half-clogged with gack, a black sticky thick stodge of carbon build-up that was strangling the engine.
It was very noticeable how much better the engine breathed, revved, accelerated & drove, with a distinctly better throttle response as soon as I cleaned it.
Being an old mechanical EGR (a rod on the throttle linkage operated a butterfly valve on the air inlet - it was easy to effect an EGR-Ectomy, which I'd done pretty soon after I bought the van in 2012.
Notably, I've never reinstated the system for Mot's, and it's emissions have never even been mentioned by a Tester.
It was very noticeable how much better the engine breathed, revved, accelerated & drove, with a distinctly better throttle response as soon as I cleaned it.
Being an old mechanical EGR (a rod on the throttle linkage operated a butterfly valve on the air inlet - it was easy to effect an EGR-Ectomy, which I'd done pretty soon after I bought the van in 2012.
Notably, I've never reinstated the system for Mot's, and it's emissions have never even been mentioned by a Tester.
frank horton
V twins are great but 4"s rule.........
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1999 VW transporter.......took the egr off and installed a blanking plate under it......end off.......
I did mine a decade ago and maybe 50k miles hence.
The engine today runs much better than when I got it.
EGR's cause way more issues for the engine than being without them.
As for the pollution - my van's emissions & smoke improved if anything. Plus, I live and use the van in the countryside, & it's a leisure/low annual mileage vehicle, so it's contribution to killing the planet is infinitesimal compared to just about anything else.
Ubique
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EGR's primarily control NOx emissions, so wouldn't have any effect upon smoke. NOx is also not a measured emission at MoT test.
Whilst it's true that a lot of vehicles 'get through' an MoT with blanked or disabled EGR systems due to the tester not being allowed to remove covers, the same is not true for VOSA roadside checks, so if caught, they could remove the vehicle as it is no longer type approval compliant and fine the driver up to £1k. The same goes for DPF & SCR 'defeats'.
I've seen primarily vehicles that do short, low temperature, low energy journeys, (commuting, school runs, etc.) with EGR related problems, vehicles that get up to a decent temperature for a sustained period on a regular basis suffer less.
Whilst it's true that a lot of vehicles 'get through' an MoT with blanked or disabled EGR systems due to the tester not being allowed to remove covers, the same is not true for VOSA roadside checks, so if caught, they could remove the vehicle as it is no longer type approval compliant and fine the driver up to £1k. The same goes for DPF & SCR 'defeats'.
I've seen primarily vehicles that do short, low temperature, low energy journeys, (commuting, school runs, etc.) with EGR related problems, vehicles that get up to a decent temperature for a sustained period on a regular basis suffer less.
Smallfry
HE's Spartacus.
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It is not killing the planet though.
If you remember, 10 -15 years ago, petrol was (and still is) the demonic fuel, producing CO2 by the lorryload, causing global warming, melting the ice caps, killing the Polar Bears etc etc etc.
This has largely been forgotten about now, because diesel has been made the demon instead. Why ? Because it "might, possibly, could, maybe" cause damage to HUMAN health. Never mind anything else, because humans are the MOST important things on the planet, despite causing most of the damaging destruction and pollution to the planet in so many other forms.
Burning diesel does actually affect the planet that much in the grand scheme of things, so my take on it is, kill a few people with diesel, or kill the planet with petrol.
No lectures on EVs please, they cause diifferent types of pollution, which in time will prove to be no better.
rtcosic
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Back in the 1990's I made this exact comparison in a presentation to a joint meeting with Departments of Transport and Environment - as usual Treasury declined to attend a meeting with us grubby industry types.
I offered a simple choice:
Continue the Duty subsidy on Diesel and Save the Polar Bears
Stop the Duty subsidy on Diesel and Save the Voters.
The decision was to gradually reduce the Duty subsidy on Diesel, But Gordon Brown took fright at the voter backlash as so many Voters has taken advantage of the Duty subsidy by buying dirty Diseasels.
As @Ubique points out the 2 most deadly emissions from Diseasels - PM 2.5 (fine particles too small to see) and NOx cannot be tested in the annual MoT test. I long ago stopped trying to educate Dieseasel owners who whine - but mine doesn't emit any smoke.
dan.taylor.1
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Is that the Ford psv colab engine that's in the freelander 2 too? Just block it off. Had a plate on mine for ages with no issues. The later ones needed a small hole or it threw up a pressure code like a blocked one would.
northwest
Searching for the Holy Grail.........
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Clever and can be interpreted two different ways too.
mtt.tr
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It will if stuck open, though it's a symptom of a problem.
typically it's stuck open because the engine is running incorrectly and/or has sooted it up
Working on big diesels that ran flat out nonstop I would often be sent to an egr fault that would end up being injectors or a turbo failed.
Bullet2012
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Quick question, was the (webasto type) pre heater functional?
I was going to ask the same thing, I have never seen any warm up issues on our D3 with a blanked EGR.
Emissions , its the one thing thats destroyed diesel engines , in fact engines in general . I wonder if on balance more garbage has been pumped into the atmosphere creating cleaner engines that dont last than they have saved by getting rid of late 90s diesels that lasted forever relatively speaking.
Our air is far cleaner now than at any time since the industrial revolution started.
Vehicle emissions are down 90% from the 1990s.
Woodburners put out far more particulates than a fleet of lorries.
In fact modern vehicles are so clean there are now more particulates produced by the tyres, brakes and road surface. All problems which effects electric cars even more as they are slightly heavier.
And yet despite technology making vehicles so much cleaner we are seeing more and more restrictions such as the LEZ etc.
Vehicle emissions are down 90% from the 1990s.
Woodburners put out far more particulates than a fleet of lorries.
In fact modern vehicles are so clean there are now more particulates produced by the tyres, brakes and road surface. All problems which effects electric cars even more as they are slightly heavier.
And yet despite technology making vehicles so much cleaner we are seeing more and more restrictions such as the LEZ etc.
Guineafowl
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My main complaint about EGRs, other than another thing to go wrong and often expensive and difficult to replace, is the amount of gunk they put into the intake. Soot mixed with turbo oil is very hard to remove, even with oven cleaner.
We’ve always run diesels, but I think with EGRs, DPFs and AdBlue, and diesel prices, the next one for the wife will be a petrol.
I’m keeping my Td5 Defender, which had its EGR blanked many years ago.
We’ve always run diesels, but I think with EGRs, DPFs and AdBlue, and diesel prices, the next one for the wife will be a petrol.
I’m keeping my Td5 Defender, which had its EGR blanked many years ago.
Smallfry
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Yes. We don't want to know anything from grubby types. Might know more than us, and spoil the agenda.
As I understand it, DPFs merely pulvererise big particles, into even more damaging small ones.
