H&S training courses to use metalworking machinery

[tigdlo]

I belive it is a requirement that anyone that uses machinery or equipment at work is trained or instructed to be able to do it safely.

I'm a vehicle mechanic by trade but have had jobs in the past where I have occasionally and infrequently used lathes, mills, drills, grinders, etc but never had any training, just self taught at home with my own kit with the help of forums, youtube, colleagues that know better than me.

Does anyone know of any courses that would satisfy H&E to make myself a bit more employable? Like with forklifts, many employers aren't willing to train. I dont need to learn the basics of machining and really can't afford to invest too much time or money.

Thanks for any help.

 

[Parm]

The better question to ask is how do I become competent

That happens with education, training and experience

 

[Melvyn Best]

The better question to ask is how do I become competent

That happens with education, training and experience

And a bit of common sense?

 

[Agrismith]

For grinders there is abrasive wheel training available which is pretty common. for everything else. We just have documented proof of a toolbox talk about the tool. There is no legal requirement to have a ticket for anything. That is down to the individual companies and what they accept.
All they must do is prove training and competence. It is their choice how they achieve that.

 

[addjunkie]

The better question to ask is how do I become competent

That happens with education, training and experience

Becoming competent and demonstrating competency to an outside agency are two very different things!

 

[8ob]

Being safety aware is a good starting point, citb run day courses and they are not expensive. Not the waste of time you would think either, its important to think about the safety of others around you and they cover all of this.

Bob

 

[Munkul]

Competency is not black and white, everyone agrees it requires knowledge, training and experience, but how you get there depends on the job at hand.
A simple one IMHO: If you have basic formal training on a lathe, say at college, and you've read the company procedures/risk assessments, all you need then is some familiarisation with a different machine and someone more competent looking over your shoulder for a week or two to make sure you're doing it right.
To me, that counts as knowledge, training and experience, proportional to the job at hand.

There comes a point for everyone where they have to sink or swim... The difference between a good company and bad is that one company leads you in from the shallow end, the other throws you in the deep end.

 

[Rrobson]

Generally there isn’t any formal H&S training for lathes, mills etc. if you complete an apprenticeship you’d spend time in a training school where they would go through safe operation and then basically let you loose with guidance to gain experience on the machine. You build competency by using the machine and becoming familiar with its functions, while also becoming confident in its use.
So I suppose there is dedicated training as a singular element in a broader training package but it’s not a formal qualification.
It’s safe use is the most important aspect but I don’t know of any stand alone courses.

I occasionally use machines in my work that I haven’t used before (obviously the longer I work the less new equipment I come across) but the way I become competent is by first familiarising myself with it prior to using it. As general machining processes are basically the same these skills and knowledge transfer so it’s just the machines operation that needs learning.

For grinders as said there are specific and affiliated courses for this which should be recognised, and sometimes are combined into a larger general working safely at work course.

 

[Munkul]

So I suppose there is dedicated training as a singular element in a broader training package but it’s not a formal qualification.

Yeah that

 

[bricol]

Competency is not black and white, everyone agrees it requires knowledge, training and experience, but how you get there depends on the job at hand.
A simple one IMHO: If you have basic formal training on a lathe, say at college, and you've read the company procedures/risk assessments, all you need then is some familiarisation with a different machine and someone more competent looking over your shoulder for a week or two to make sure you're doing it right.
To me, that counts as knowledge, training and experience, proportional to the job at hand.

There comes a point for everyone where they have to sink or swim... The difference between a good company and bad is that one company leads you in from the shallow end, the other throws you in the deep end.

That is how we seem to work - and as they took all manual machines out of the adjustment cell, bang went my capacity to do my own fettling as I have no CNC ability, and I have to fill in forms and wait like everyone else . . . it used to be fun to see the surprised looks on faces as a (senior) design engineer actually did stuff

Mind you - I was told a tale last year - someone checked out on the grinders, but the work being done wasn't coming out to drawing, and in-fact had a very funny surface finish too . . . seems no one had thought to check if the guy knew how to turn the wheel on, and he had simply been "knurling" the parts with the wheel . .

 

[Parm]

Becoming competent and demonstrating competency to an outside agency are two very different things!

Please explain

 

[8ob]

An outside agency would only recognise an operatives competency through the paper trail/training and would have little to no knowledge of the capabilities of that person.Pretty much down to an employer to assess whether a potential employee is competent or not, that's what trial periods are all about. A friend of mine runs a transport business and finding good drivers is a nightmare because good or bad they are all waiving the same certs.

Bob

 

[winchman]

if you're in merseyside, I wouldnt be calling Rufforth or Newark as local with them being 200mile round trips. I didnt go to my local (10 miles away) autojumble a couple of weeks ago as it was raining......and that is held inside. and that one in Huddersfield is much closer to you than either Rufforth or Newark.

An outside agency would only recognise an operatives competency through the paper trail/training and would have little to no knowledge of the capabilities of that person.Pretty much down to an employer to assess whether a potential employee is competent or not, that's what trial periods are all about. A friend of mine runs a transport business and finding good drivers is a nightmare because good or bad they are all waiving the same certs.

Bob

Thats a very interesting statement. I feel employers need to closely train and examine any employees during trial periods as many people can pass an exam but have little idea of how to do it in a real world.
I have met several NEBOSH qualified people who basically did a two week course on how to pass the exam, but come out of the other end with a nice cert but little practical idea.

 

[MetalMonkey]

Please explain

Well of course you can be competent at doing something, without having any paperwork to prove it.
And you can have all the correct paperwork without actually being competent.

The two concepts are often only loosely related, and sometimes not at all.
Any "proof" of competency is always going to be based on some form of assessment, and not actual competency.

 

[Parm]

Competency is achieved through education, qualification, experience and training

 

[Agrismith]

Competency is achieved through education, qualification, experience and training

But education qualifications experience and training don't always lead to someone being competent.
The training and qualifications industry in this country has long since taken its eye off the goal. And instead just become another money spinner

 

[Robert Weaver]

Some people can seem competant on paper, but not somehow when it comes to application. The experience should cover that, but it assumes that with time, the person "gets it" and improves, gets more confident, etc.

 

[winchman]

Some people can seem competant on paper, but not somehow when it comes to application.

These are Origami Engineers ( very good on paper)

 

[addjunkie]

Please explain

A person can achieve a level of competency at a skill with training and experience. But for an organisation to demonstrate levels of competency to an outside agency a documented competency process including written competency assessment, with a set review and validation process is required. Apart from a driving license there are very few industries that have competency for life after the initial test.
For example I have a class 1 license as a Marine Engineer. But if I dont use it Ineed to have it revalidated. A welder needs to keep his codes up to date with retesting, but his company keeps records of of it to demonstrate to others their quality. Sparkies do part18…19 or whatever body they work too.

 

[tigdlo]

Thank you for all the replies, plenty to think about but as it would be company dependant and may not make myself anymore employable I probably won't invest right now as the best I can find is around £950 1 week lathe or vertical mill course, so over £2k for both by the time I've added petrol.