Advice on Wanting to set up on my own

[Rich#1984]

I’m wanting to set up a little fab business of my own specialising in custom bbq’s but also offering general fabrication like fences and gates etc and I’m looking for advice on how to go about it any advice would be brilliant

 

[cumbriasteve]

Are you considering full time or part time, will it involve leaving employment ?

There will always be a market for custom made BBQ's but it will be very limited and seasonal, even general gates and railings tend to have dead periods, most people do garden and drive updates when the weather is good.

There is very little money in standard 'keep the dog in' gates, when you can buy them cheap off the net it makes it difficult to compete and obtain a decent hourly rate.

Many think if they sell ten gates at £100 then £1000 a week is a great wage, the reality is after all costs are removed there will only be about £300 left...not much of a wage.

The real money is in top quality custom made items, the problem is it takes time to become known, if you start a business on Monday work will not come in on Tuesday and when it does start it will be a trickle.

Also consider taxation, accident/sickness insurance, third party insurance and a few more nasty must haves to prevent a nightmare scenario.

Think about how much money you would like/need each week to live then multiply it by three, that is roughly the minimum amount of sales you will need if you have your costs and profit margins about right.

Not trying to put you off but it would be wrong to say yeah go for it and you will be a success, many do but a lot don't.

Your local HMRC will offer free and I found very friendly helpful advice, they used to and may still provide free day courses, I learnt a lot attending that....certainly beneficial.

My advice for anyone already employed is have a go part time to start with, it gives you a good idea if it will work.

 

[angellonewolf]

a mates dad made a fair amout of extra cash doing gates and fencing but never got it more than a good part time add in he was a general builder was trying to get out of it but could never get enough work in

 

[hotponyshoes]

How about starting it up part time first.
Make a few bits and bobs for yourself and friends etc. Use the photos from these as marketing material. (Remember to keep records of all the costs as you can offset this in the future)

Do a bit of advertising and see what inteest you get. If you get to the stage when you are doing a couple of hours every night of the week and both days on a weekend than that's 3 days work a week so at that stage you could then give up the day job and have your eves/weekends back, have an extra day for paper work and an extra day for marketing.

The hard part is, as said above, the decent money is in custom items made to order. For anything high value the client is going to want to meet you in person, see samples, drawings and have you come to site and fit it in person.

 

[brightspark]

are u working full time in a job if so just start a part time business up .I ran a part time hire business from home was lucky the neighbours never bothered me . also used to do shot and sandblasting rented a building of a farmer a tenner as week .both were doing real well . started on my own full time doing my job and got to doing hundreds of callouts for a biggish firm subcontract and big ££££ so packed the part time jobs in

 

[Rich#1984]

Cheers for the advice I’m in full time employment so would be setting it up part time to begin with anyway I’m already working at a place that does fences, gates and custom pieces so I’m used to how that works but I’ll definitely get some pics together of stuff I do at home and see what response I get

 

[RIP]

The most difficult bit is finding the customers.

Bear in mind what they call "scarcity of work", ie for every paid hours work how much unpaid work are you doing.

Eg I'll be lucky if I can bill half my weekly time. The rest of the time is spent doing admin, after sales, presales, marketing, keeping up on the industry etc.

Then deduct overheads, and marketing costs and remember there's only 232 working days in the year after weekends, vacation and bank holidays.

Run those numbers and you'll see just how much you need to bill per hour to earn a salary. It will surprise you.

Still, I'd never go back to working for anyone.

In find the way to make these things work is you need to be fast and that means having years of experience behind you so you can do things fast but to high standard.

 

[cumbriasteve]

When I was doing the gates etc I was very busy and then we had the 1980 steel strike, overnight obtaining steel became a nightmare, the big users bought up stock and any left was kept for 'friends' customers.

I survived it because I was dabbling in other things but it taught me a lesson, when self employed never think you are safe.

I was then offered a 40 hour week occupation with very good money, brilliant pension, holidays and more..so I took it.

I realised making gates etc part time was much more enjoyable because the money part of it was not essential for survival, I could turn away the rubbish, work when I wanted and at the speed I wanted.

I now believe if you have an occupation that you like, pays the bills and covers your pension, stay and work in your spare time, it can be a very good earner without the risk.

Of course you will never be a millionaire with villas dotted around the world but I don't know of any gate makers who reached that status.

 

[Cobbler]

[QUOTE="
Of course you will never be a millionaire with villas dotted around the world but I don't know of any gate makers who reached that status. [/QUOTE]
Bil Gates sorry Steve, couldn't resist it.

I've never been self employed, but know a lot that have ..... And struggled, I would say Steve's reply is good advice

 

[Kent]

When I was doing the gates etc I was very busy and then we had the 1980 steel strike, overnight obtaining steel became a nightmare, the big users bought up stock and any left was kept for 'friends' customers.

I survived it because I was dabbling in other things but it taught me a lesson, when self employed never think you are safe.

I was then offered a 40 hour week occupation with very good money, brilliant pension, holidays and more..so I took it.

I realised making gates etc part time was much more enjoyable because the money part of it was not essential for survival, I could turn away the rubbish, work when I wanted and at the speed I wanted.

I now believe if you have an occupation that you like, pays the bills and covers your pension, stay and work in your spare time, it can be a very good earner without the risk.

Of course you will never be a millionaire with villas dotted around the world but I don't know of any gate makers who reached that status.

I know two Brian Rouke being the first and I knew him before he had a power saw he used to cut everything with a hand driven hack saw. Roukes of Burnley Sadly the buisness failed after his retirement just around the bankers crash.. Brain himself passed away a few months ago
Peter who owns and operates North Valley Forge in Nelson is the other guy.

 

[Kent]

Cheers for the advice I’m in full time employment so would be setting it up part time to begin with anyway I’m already working at a place that does fences, gates and custom pieces so I’m used to how that works but I’ll definitely get some pics together of stuff I do at home and see what response I get

Rich, looking at the fact you where looking for your first job in the Industry last year I should say hold on a good few years yet.. Maybe take on an odd foreigner perhaps ?

There is money to be had and gates and such can sell for far more than many expect or believe but the quality has to be good .

When your on your own it's you who needs to sort everything so you better know the job very well before you dive in at the deep end .

It takes at least three years to build a half way decent reputation and only one bad job gone wrong to loose it.

 

[eLuSiVeMiTe]

When I was doing the gates etc I was very busy and then we had the 1980 steel strike, overnight obtaining steel became a nightmare, the big users bought up stock and any left was kept for 'friends' customers.

I survived it because I was dabbling in other things but it taught me a lesson, when self employed never think you are safe.

I was then offered a 40 hour week occupation with very good money, brilliant pension, holidays and more..so I took it.

I realised making gates etc part time was much more enjoyable because the money part of it was not essential for survival, I could turn away the rubbish, work when I wanted and at the speed I wanted.

I now believe if you have an occupation that you like, pays the bills and covers your pension, stay and work in your spare time, it can be a very good earner without the risk.

Of course you will never be a millionaire with villas dotted around the world but I don't know of any gate makers who reached that status.

Rich, looking at the fact you where looking for your first job in the Industry last year I should say hold on a good few years yet.. Maybe take on an odd foreigner perhaps ?

There is money to be had and gates and such can sell for far more than many expect or believe but the quality has to be good .

When your on your own it's you who needs to sort everything so you better know the job very well before you dive in at the deep end .

It takes at least three years to build a half way decent reputation and only one bad job gone wrong to loose it.

Sound advice.

Took a year subbing with a local builder in the area before going it alone.
Recently moved here at the time.
Gave me time to make contacts and sort out suppliers well in advance.
Im lucky as I can diversify into many trades but would really struggle if I only did one.


Do you have any other trades/skills you could utalise to keep money trickling in when the fab side is slow

 

[danbrown89]

You should absolutely throw yourself at it Rich! It’s 2018 and you can create and grow a business for next to nothing! Websites can be hosted for a few pounds a month, you can do your own google listings to get found on search engines, you can buy data for 20p per record and approach people/advertise for free via social media. But it’s defiantly a numbers game - I’ve probably approached over 1000 to get 20 regular new customers, which probably gives me £15-20k turnover per month. My aim is to get 10 new regular (good paying!) clients per year which is very achievable. Welding/metalwork isnot a popular trade in comparison to sparks/plumbing etc so your only completion is yourself! Go for it !

 

[danbrown89]

Also people buy people it doesn’t matter about your reputation, longevity in the market or price (in my opinion) if they don’t like you they won’t use you! Be nice and they will financially be nice to you

 

[Windy Miller]

You should absolutely throw yourself at it Rich! It’s 2018 and you can create and grow a business for next to nothing! Websites can be hosted for a few pounds a month, you can do your own google listings to get found on search engines, you can buy data for 20p per record and approach people/advertise for free via social media. But it’s defiantly a numbers game - I’ve probably approached over 1000 to get 20 regular new customers, which probably gives me £15-20k turnover per month. My aim is to get 10 new regular (good paying!) clients per year which is very achievable. Welding/metalwork isnot a popular trade in comparison to sparks/plumbing etc so your only completion is yourself! Go for it !

That all sounds very interesting DB - what line of work are you in? I'd like to know more about all this!

 

[winchman]

Would your present boss be unhappy if you went in to competition whilst still employed?
I would start part time and only do bespoke jobs, avoid the low paid mass production, if the job wont yield a good profit dont do it.

 

[cumbriasteve]

I’ve probably approached over 1000 to get 20 regular new customers, which probably gives me £15-20k turnover per month. My aim is to get 10 new regular (good paying!) clients per year which is very achievable. Welding/metalwork isnot a popular trade in comparison to sparks/plumbing etc so your only completion is yourself! Go for it !

I doubt I had such a thing as regular customers in the gates and railings game, there was the local council but getting paid at the end of the job was like getting blood out of a stone so they were dumped fast, the churches were even worse, sob stories and late payment everytime, so they went the same way.

You could always end up with someone like B&Q as a regular customer if you wanted to make 50p profit a gate.

Some trades you can build up a repeat and regular customer base, not an easy task to identify or achieve with gates.

I do agree though it's never been easier or as cheap to advertise, I only had the local paper and that was an expensive method of trying to get out there.

 

[Kent]

I should have to say recommendations have really taken off for me but it's four years down the line from when I set up full time. I have yet to be recommended by a cheaper / bardic job I took on which bodes well because average order value is massively higher today for me. I hope it continues that way.
Social media yes a big yes, websites?? Three so far all pants! One of my current clients is a full on Web developer pulling around 3k a week off one customer alone (and he has way more than that) .. His advice to me was forget all but specialists In your area with real experience and pay them a percentage rather than a fee which I think is where I have been going wrong..

 

[bigegg]

One of my current clients is a full on Web developer pulling around 3k a week off one customer alone (and he has way more than that) .. His advice to me was forget all but specialists In your area with real experience and pay them a percentage rather than a fee which I think is where I have been going wrong..

More info please?

A percentage of what?
An online store?
Or based on jobs obtained through the website?
Or a full web marketing service where they will advertise via farcebutt etc and get commission on sales?

Genuinely interested, as it's something I'm looking into.

 

[Kent]

More info please?

A percentage of what?
An online store?
Or based on jobs obtained through the website?
Or a full web marketing service where they will advertise via farcebutt etc and get commission on sales?

Genuinely interested, as it's something I'm looking into.

In this case a percent of online sales which of course he can track.

You can set this sort of deal up on a smaller scale of course. I have a friend who pays a man to do similar for his resin cement buisness