How much

[Welderpaul]

Few years ago we were fitting the balustrades on a big residential apartment job - there was an interior design company employed by a few of the new residents who were doing the fit out - they were doing a roaring trade on low level coffee tables - Euro pallets with four casters, wazed brown. £350-00 a pop.

Pallet £4, casters £15, hours labour for each one?...

Wrong game

 

[julianf]

Remember 20% will be vat, so that takes it to 320. Retailer will want half, so £170 to make.

If you could knock them out all day long, you would still be ok though.

 

[rtcosic]

Remember 20% will be vat, so that takes it to 320. Retailer will want half, so £170 to make.

If you could knock them out all day long, you would still be ok though.

Less freight, less cost of 90+ days credit terms, less returns for spurious damage, less...........

 

[ukracer]

Remember 20% will be vat, so that takes it to 320. Retailer will want half, so £170 to make.

If you could knock them out all day long, you would still be ok though.

where do you go where the retailer works on 50%?

I thought they started around 30% going down depending on competition etc.

I take your point though.

 

[Kent]

Yes that's £400 for some 70mm box and a bit of timber I understand people have to make a living but wow

Its not done for a hobby at that let me explain
10% marketing cost £40
£360
20% vat
£300
Six hours labour including employment taxes£120
£180
Materials £80

£100
£60 premises
£40
£10 consumables, accountancy,, wear on machines
£30 and the need to sell thirty a week to make the buisness viable

I wonder why the greatest majority of new buisness fails within 18 months leaving the owners out of pocket ?

GO see how long the local garage will work on your car for £400. And what parts and consumables come free within that amount.

 

[Kent]

where do you go where the retailer works on 50%?

I thought they started around 30% going down depending on competition etc.

I take your point though.

Depends on what your retail dealer is actually selling.
Trebling the buying in price is not unusual for some items others might only make 5%.
But hey anyone can set up a buisness - first three years failure rates prove this fact

 

[ukracer]

£30 and the need to sell thirty a week to make the buisness viable

With something like that you are not going to sell 30 per week even if you could make 30 in that time...plus shipping will massively increase the end cost to the buyer.

 

[8ob]

Yes that's £400 for some 70mm box and a bit of timber I understand people have to make a living but wow

I milled a few sticks of oak for a mate and in return he knocked up the table below, he makes these in his spare time and they normally take about a day to build, he gets around £1500 for them. Seems to be no shortage of customers prepared to buy this sort of thing

 

[bigegg]

Its not done for a hobby at that let me explain
10% marketing cost £40
£360
20% vat
£300
Six hours labour including employment taxes£120
£180
Materials £80

£100
£60 premises
£40
£10 consumables, accountancy,, wear on machines
£30 and the need to sell thirty a week to make the buisness viable

I wonder why the greatest majority of new buisness fails within 18 months leaving the owners out of pocket ?

GO see how long the local garage will work on your car for £400. And what parts and consumables come free within that amount.

I get your point about less profit than it appears when all costs are taken into account, but I disagree with some of your figures.

£60 premises cost per table X 30 tables per week
= 1800 quid a week for rent and utilities?!?

I paid £200 a week for a 2000sqft workshop/warehouse including electric.
Phone/broadband was £30 a month.
So not even close to your figure.
Even if we said £360 a week to include a van, premises cost is £12 per table so that's +£48 profit per table.

There's not six hours labour in one of them either:
Four men[1]: one welding, one cutting, one fixing, one finishing, could knock out at least eight a day, so labour is nearer £80

There's another +£40 profit.

So profit is nearer £118 per table.
And that's net, so business owner could draw a two grand a week wage and STILL reinvest 1500 a week into the business - which could BUY a workshop in about 2-3 years, so reducing premises costs by another £150? a week - or £5 a table extra profit.


I'm not saying you're wrong in overestimating the expenses, btw, just that there *is* scope for significant profit there.


I reckon I could make 10 of those a week in my garage (when I get it cleared!): One day cutting. One day welding. One day finishing one day fixing. One day "marketing" and bookkeeping.
Maybe 10-12 hour days, but at £4k a week turnover, there'd be a nice wage in it.
IF I could sell ten a week!

Oh. 50% is the commision I used to pay to sell my wheelbarrow planters in various shops around Leeds.
I don't know if that's standard, but I was happy with it, they were happy with it.
It worked out about £30 wage for a half days work on a £120 planter - early 90s, 4 a week, so a weekends work. Paid my mortgage, and was better than what I got for same hours' bar work. (I was a full time student with three kids, so had to work evenings and weekends)






[1] other genders are available.

 

[slim_boy_fat]

[1] other genders are available.

 

[vwmark]

I used to run a company making mountain bike disc brake pads.

Cost to produce was 30p a pair.

We sold to a national distributor for £1.

He sold to a chain of distributors for £2.20.

He sold to retail for around £4.

Shop sold to public between £12 and £15!

A lot of this was on sale or return so they had nothing to loose.

 

[Revs1972]

I used to run a company making mountain bike disc brake pads.

Cost to produce was 30p a pair.

We sold to a national distributor for £1.

He sold to a chain of distributors for £2.20.

He sold to retail for around £4.

Shop sold to public between £12 and £15!

A lot of this was on sale or return so they had nothing to loose.

Just out of curiosity.....
Were they your design or did you make them for your customer to their design etc ?

 

[Kent]

I get your point about less profit than it appears when all costs are taken into account, but I disagree with some of your figures.

£60 premises cost per table X 30 tables per week
= 1800 quid a week for rent and utilities?!?

I paid £200 a week for a 2000sqft workshop/warehouse including electric.
Phone/broadband was £30 a month.
So not even close to your figure.
Even if we said £360 a week to include a van, premises cost is £12 per table so that's +£48 profit per table.

There's not six hours labour in one of them either:
Four men[1]: one welding, one cutting, one fixing, one finishing, could knock out at least eight a day, so labour is nearer £80

There's another +£40 profit.

So profit is nearer £118 per table.
And that's net, so business owner could draw a two grand a week wage and STILL reinvest 1500 a week into the business - which could BUY a workshop in about 2-3 years, so reducing premises costs by another £150? a week - or £5 a table extra profit.


I'm not saying you're wrong in overestimating the expenses, btw, just that there *is* scope for significant profit there.


I reckon I could make 10 of those a week in my garage (when I get it cleared!): One day cutting. One day welding. One day finishing one day fixing. One day "marketing" and bookkeeping.
Maybe 10-12 hour days, but at £4k a week turnover, there'd be a nice wage in it.
IF I could sell ten a week!

Oh. 50% is the commision I used to pay to sell my wheelbarrow planters in various shops around Leeds.
I don't know if that's standard, but I was happy with it, they were happy with it.
It worked out about £30 wage for a half days work on a £120 planter - early 90s, 4 a week, so a weekends work. Paid my mortgage, and was better than what I got for same hours' bar work. (I was a full time student with three kids, so had to work evenings and weekends)






[1] other genders are available.

Sorry but you ain't gonna sell 30 of those a week with a 10% marketing cost
Should have made my comments about the need and the reality being discontinued. But wasnt paying full attention with having to earn a living

 

[Kent]

With something like that you are not going to sell 30 per week even if you could make 30 in that time...plus shipping will massively increase the end cost to the buyer.

Yes and a 10% marketing spend would be a dream that would also never push sales to thirty units a week
Should have clarified the fact that 30 units just wasn't going to happen

 

[bigegg]

Sorry but you ain't gonna sell 30 of those a week with a 10% marketing cost
Should have made my comments about the need and the reality being discontinued. But wasnt paying full attention with having to earn a living

Of course you're not going to sell 30 a week.
You'd make 30 a year, then use the production facilities to make other products.
Either way, the production costs aren't going to be as high as you stated, and thus the profit margin is going to be much higher.

I'm lucky, I don't have to earn a living - I sold my business and retired early.

I'm studying for my MBA now, so this is just like homework.

 

[vwmark]

Just out of curiosity.....
Were they your design or did you make them for your customer to their design etc ?

Both. Made some for OEM but majority were aftermarket.

 

[Revs1972]

Both. Made some for OEM but majority were aftermarket.

Did you try selling direct, or is that a tough market to break into ?

 

[zeppelin builder]

Yes that's £400 for some 70mm box and a bit of timber I understand people have to make a living but wow

Where is the anvil

 

[MattH]

There’s a lot of arm chair hero’s on this thread stating how easy it would be and how much net profit they’d making knocking out the same stuff.

There’s also guys on here that do this sort of stuff for a living telling you it’s not that simple.

I’ve been working on getting a new business off the ground manufacturing retail product for the last 2.5 years. It’s turning over strong money and our product has a lot more profit margin % than those tables.

Two of us are working 70 hours a week and haven’t taken a penny out of the business. In fact our directors loan accounts owe us plenty.

Soon we will turn a corner and the business will start paying out well. At that point should I be knocked for making a decent profit? Yes you could make something similar to what we sell in your spare time for less money.
Try making 100000 per year and earn a living from it, I dare you!

 

[zeppelin builder]

There’s a lot of arm chair hero’s on this thread stating how easy it would be and how much net profit they’d making knocking out the same stuff.

There’s also guys on here that do this sort of stuff for a living telling you it’s not that simple.

I’ve been working on getting a new business off the ground manufacturing retail product for the last 2.5 years. It’s turning over strong money and our product has a lot more profit margin % than those tables.

Two of us are working 70 hours a week and haven’t taken a penny out of the business. In fact our directors loan accounts owe us plenty.

Soon we will turn a corner and the business will start paying out well. At that point should I be knocked for making a decent profit? Yes you could make something similar to what we sell in your spare time for less money.
Try making 100000 per year and earn a living from it, I dare you!

I agree its easier sometimes to get a decent paid job no worries . If you counted up the unpaid hours you put in too and the 24 x7 commitment its a big price for freedom
Me im still waiting on the hot work permit