They wont be full for long.Just out of interest, has anyone tried just purging the darned things and chopping them up while full of CO2/Argon?
They wont be full for long.Just out of interest, has anyone tried just purging the darned things and chopping them up while full of CO2/Argon?
Blimey, I feel such a cowboy.... I just take the valves out, leave them over night and then rinse a couple of times and set to it with the plasma cutter!!!!
They wont be full for long.
Wow thanks for the physics lesson. I wish I had you around when I was studying engineering and then my commercial pilot exams. You would have made life so much easier........Go buy a lottery ticket, clearly your luck is in if you can chop up a bomb with a plasma torch. The problem is not that there might be a lot of residual propane/butane in that enclosed space, the problem is if there is a tiny amount which mixed with oxygen will ignite and burn in a fraction of a second i.e. explode! Too little gas/fuel and it won't burn, too much ditto, get it just right and BANG!
Again the problem is not with such a small amount of gas burning and expanding, the problem is the enclosed space or what we might refer to as the bomb casing. When a gas ignites and heats up, it expands rapidly. If that happens in an enclosed space it has nowhere to go so the pressure increases rapidly, very rapidly.
I should have used the word "purge" but if there is no oxygen in the tank because it's "full" of an inert gas, it cannot explode. Once the cut is made, you might suggest oxygen can "get in" and while I wouldn't risk it without a continuous purge, I sincerely doubt it would explode.
It's one of those subjects though and no amount of speculation regarding safety is going to get us anywhere. It is an inherently dangerous thing to do and the HSE requirements for performing the job correctly would be far outside the scope of your average DIYer. I guess that's why every once in a while one of them lucks out.
Wow thanks for the physics lesson. I wish I had you around when I was studying engineering and then my commercial pilot exams. You would have made life so much easier........
And for the record what you have said is mostly tosh in relation to this question. Once the tank is drained and washed there is nothing left in it to ignite.....
Once the tank is drained and washed there is nothing left in it to ignite.....
I agree with Mr Shiney.
I myself have been known to use an impact gun to spin the valve off. Put the hose in it, fill it to the top and leave it for a bit, tip it over and let it drain. Then get either of my two plasma cutters and go to town on it.
If people don’t have the real world balls to do the job then they should stick to knitting, far safer and less chance of an explosion.
When people give advice it’s because they have had experience doing that job, when people choose to ignore it that’s just ignorance. Nobody on this forum will give advice to put someone in harms way.
My advice is........ grow a pair
Top advice, I was being polite and saying have confidenceI agree with Mr Shiney.
I myself have been known to use an impact gun to spin the valve off. Put the hose in it, fill it to the top and leave it for a bit, tip it over and let it drain. Then get either of my two plasma cutters and go to town on it.
If people don’t have the real world balls to do the job then they should stick to knitting, far safer and less chance of an explosion.
When people give advice it’s because they have had experience doing that job, when people choose to ignore it that’s just ignorance. Nobody on this forum will give advice to put someone in harms way.
My advice is........ grow a pair
I have to agree here, nothing wrong with this at allSorry I no longer run training courses or lecture, the only advice I can offer is that people who lean on their qualifications tend to look a lot sillier when they fall over. Oops, did I say qualification which you didn't actually say which typically means you don't actually have. I can let you have one of my degrees I suppose.
Waving your hands grandiosely in the air and saying "tosh" is a little to vague for my liking. I'm up for a debate, what do your "studies" tell you is tosh?
1. A tiny amount of propane mixed with oxygen will ignite and burn
2. It will burn in a fraction of a second i.e. explode
3. When a gas ignites and heats up, it expands rapidly
4. If that happens in an enclosed space the pressure increases very rapidly
5. If the tank is full of an inert gas it cannot explode
6. It is an inherently dangerous thing to do
7. The HSE requirements for performing the job correctly would be onerous
While you put me right on those salient points let me pick you up on the only thing you said that wasn't dripping with sarcasm or irrelevant self aggrandising:
That is dangerous nonsense. Small pockets of liquid propane/butane but especially oils and other fuels can actually persist even after the tank has been flushed out with water. I'm going to guess the low viscosity allows tiny amounts to cling onto microscopic cracks or pores in the structure of the tank. Over time they might evaporate or become gaseous in the presence of heat. The stenching agent persists after flushing and that smell tells you some product is still present and emitting fumes. Propane on the other hand is odourless and relying on the residual gas being only because a bit of stenching agent is left behind is a false positive. You might expect to be able to smell it after washing but you can draw no conclusion from its presence other than that the tank is not sterile.
Bottom line is cutting up old fuel tanks is dangerous. Cutting them up safely is so difficult its almost a non sequitur.
There are hazards associated with cutting open a tank. Bit like everything else we do, they all have hazards.
The consequences of the hazards associated with cutting open tanks are right at the top of the tree, Fatality.
However there is no such job on the planet that cant be done safely.
Im not going into the various methods of establishing gas safe, of which there are many.
But I can say I've cut open at least 20 to 30 tanks varying in size up to 47Kg and im still here typing away on the forum.
I know it can be done safely, but you MUST have the confidence
I have to agree here, nothing wrong with this at all
Agree here too.
I was about to pull out my arm chair to sit and watch the debate was hoping it might drift into something new, not been duscussed before, as someone who was paid and trusted by a major oil company to be incharge of stuff like this on a large scale some things I read on the internet I find really scary. 99.99 times out of a hundred it goes ok, the time it doesnt, is the time you best hope your wife has you well insured.
The upshot is if you are happy with your own interpritation of gas free, then go ahead and cut, if youre not dont.
But do not be under any illusion if you get this wrong it can and possibly will end in tears.