cellulose rods

[vwhotrod]

Evening All,
It's been a while since I asked a question on here,so once again I call on you're combined expertise please.
I have 2 questions so here goes;
1.In laymans terms what are cellulose rods and where are they used;
2.My FRONIUS TP1500 inverter has 4 paramater arc settings from hard to soft arc what are the advantages of this?I learned on a pickarc 185 amp oilcooled choke type from pickhill "the one with the coloured rod for amp settings" so I'm not used to having paramaters.
Thanks for reading,
Martin.

 

[shenion]

1. Cellulose rods have a "wood-fiber based" flux coating. Most common are 6010 and 6011's that offer deeper penetration. Also lots of smoke .

2. hard/soft arc usually refers to inductance settings. Soft has increased inductance for more arc stability and a "wetter" weld pool. Hard has less inductance with more arc noise but also has less weld pool fluidity. Soft will provide smoother welds, hard may help positional welding.

 

[TechnicAl]

In the UK cellulosics are almost exclusively used for pipe welding, usually the large diameter stuff for gas and water. Its commonly performed vertically down and known as stovepipe welding. Contrary to all other rods, Cellulosics have to contain some water or the welds will be porous so they are usually supplied in tins to keep them wet.

Cellulosics are a good test of a set. If if will run a cellulosic it will run anything. There are a lot of inverters that cant run them.

I believe in the USA they use cellulosics for most fabrication much the same as we in Europe use 6013's.

 

[Drains]

Hey vw. Cellulosics are as described above, and to fill in Als post a little, they usually require a high OCV to run (hence the "good test of a set" comment). I have a Lincoln inverter that will run cellulosics and a Eutectic one that won't.

In addition to lots of smoke, they also give a very strong and forceful arc which is easy to control, as there is almost no slag, and the weld metal freezes very quickly. The arc is strong enough that you can turn up the juice a little and pierce a hole through plate.

Cellusosic welds are not pretty though, and they are not strong (they can crack) unless further welds are run over them, to remove the hydrogen in the weld. (That right Al?)

6010's run DC only. 6011's AC/DC.

 

[snowcat]

A 6011 with 80OCV......yep pretty nope......... and visions very much overrated when welding isn't it

 

[shenion]

I believe in the USA they use cellulosics for most fabrication much the same as we in Europe use 6013's.

6013's are popular here. Most common for DIY use (many DIY rods are not even marked with a code, just "general purpose").

I don't see much references to cellulose 6010/6011s outside of pipe welding. They are rare on ebay and some sellers.

I do notice the 7014's I like are becoming more popular. More people carry them, many on ebay and I see more referenced to them on discussion boards.

6010's run DC only. 6011's AC/DC.

My first test with the Airco was with 6010's. AC (figured test AC first as it would not use the rectifier that might be bad.) The result was not pretty

Then tried DCEP and DCEN and found one was much better.

 

[vwhotrod]

Thank's for the quick and helpfull response folks,
I bought the Fronius inverter about a year ago,I needed a portable
with a good duty cycle, guy at the supply store said it was an expensive machine but guranteed me it would burn at least 40 3.2mm rods without cutting out,I've never reached 40 but it's never cut out on me either.Reason I asked about cellulose is the machine has a cellulose setting on it.There is also a tig option on it but I guess I'll never need tig or cellulose settings. Thanks for the lesson on arc paramaters SHENION, will prove very helpfull.Thank's again Simon ,Al,Snowcat,Shenion, for your valued opinions.
Regards,
Martin

 

[vwhotrod]

O
Once again, thanks guys for your knowledge and help.
Shenion the paramater settings on the arc really do help on positional ,so thanks for the help on that.
Best regards,
Martin.

 

[shenion]

Glad to help with something I have never tried My arc welders do not have adjustable inductance although my MIG does.

Saw how the Lincoln did it by wrapping a bunch of turns of small wire around the reactor coil and have a variable dummy load on it. May try it, the Airco has a coil the size of a car battery, makes for nice arc but welds are very 'wet" at times.

 

[fillncap]

hi guys

heres a picture of E6010 pipe cap i did last year .i dont have the root picture of this the camera seemed to malfunction.

fnc

 

[scarecrow]

ARC FORCE
Non-latched/latched, MMA/TIG, HF ignition/Liftarc
2- and 4-stroke logic
can anyone tell me what these mean on an inverter and what exactly they do

 

[snowcat]

arc force makes a more aggressive weld, latch is for tig'n Latched locks the arc in with one press unlatched, you have to hold the button (like a MIG trigger), HF again for the Tig (High frequency ignition), and lift arc is where you touch down to start (again TIG), 2 and four stroke logic, is this a lorch? or Lincoln, something stirs but I cant quite remmber.....

 

[scarecrow]

four stroke logic is on the lorch

 

[weldequip]

2T = press the trigger...weld...release the trigger, stop welding.
4T = press trigger, weld 'ramps up' at lower amps, press trigger again full pre-set amps kicks in, press trigger again amps 'ramp down', press trigger for 4th.time...weld stops; helps prevent burning edges at the start/end of a weld.
weldequip

 

[scarecrow]

thanks weldequip I see you have a lorch as your profile picture have you been headhunted by matt

 

[snowcat]

2T = press the trigger...weld...release the trigger, stop welding.
4T = press trigger, weld 'ramps up' at lower amps, press trigger again full pre-set amps kicks in, press trigger again amps 'ramp down', press trigger for 4th.time...weld stops; helps prevent burning edges at the start/end of a weld.
weldequip

option 2 buy a pedal

 

[weldequip]

thanks weldequip I see you have a lorch as your profile picture have you been headhunted by matt

Yes, the man's been pestering me for ages!
weldequip

 

[scarecrow]

Should have gone you then matt Irish supplier still hasn't got in touch with me

 

[snowcat]

Should have gone you then matt Irish supplier still hasn't got in touch with me

what model you looking at scarecrow?

 

[irondarren]

option 2 buy a pedal

Did that for my inverter fusion unit, cost £250 but worth it. Totally different, far more controllable. The funny thing is the foot pedal even works when arc welding. Allowing amp control on MMA