Uncouth machinery handling

  1. Spark plug

    Spark plug Member

    Messages:
    3,459
    Location:
    Durham, England
    So while investigating a alignment issue with the tail stock on my DSG lathe I found that 4 needle bearings in the clamping mechanism had been damaged and the only explanation is the lathe has at some point been lifted by the tailstock :o.

    Initially I slid the tailstock off to make sure they was no dirt stuck to the ways causing the issues, Not an easy feat as it weighs in excess of 100kg. When I put the tailstock back on I noticed some bearing rollers left on the bench :(, so back off if came and I found this:

    CBC067C5-C055-4458-A715-B8E1E18ED1E1.jpeg 985E1F6F-23AE-4392-A5E6-3C6E25E482C8.jpeg CFF837FB-70D7-4AC1-848C-BE8BAD18D767.jpeg 744EDDC4-0C1E-46B3-B8D3-0101242877FF.jpeg

    It’s easily repairable, but should have never happened, and also begs the question ware was the sling at the other end of the machine?

    I have read a number of times about machinery dealers being less than sympathetic when moving machines.

    What are people’s experiences of such things?
     
    Brad93 likes this.
  2. Brad93

    Brad93 M J B Engineering

    Messages:
    6,661
    Location:
    Essex
    Had a Harrison 140 years ago that had been lifted from the chuck. Spindle was shot.
     
  3. Hood

    Hood Forum Supporter

    Messages:
    10,012
    Location:
    Carnoustie, Scotland
    You look a lot younger in your avatar ;)
     
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  4. Spark plug

    Spark plug Member

    Messages:
    3,459
    Location:
    Durham, England
    could you elaborate please? Was it bearings or bent spindle?
     
  5. Brad93

    Brad93 M J B Engineering

    Messages:
    6,661
    Location:
    Essex
    No idea sold it on for double the money to someone who thought they could fix it
     
    Spark plug likes this.
  6. pressbrake1

    pressbrake1 Forum Supporter

    Messages:
    1,816
    essex england
    Shows the class of the dsg
     
  7. Spark plug

    Spark plug Member

    Messages:
    3,459
    Location:
    Durham, England
    Indeed, the over engineering is a constant amazement.
     
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  8. pressbrake1

    pressbrake1 Forum Supporter

    Messages:
    1,816
    essex england
    Harrison is light enough not to harm the spindle, not that you should.
    Long whipping bars hanging out will do it
    Ive seen animals put jacks on a lathe bed to straighten bars:o
     
  9. Spark plug

    Spark plug Member

    Messages:
    3,459
    Location:
    Durham, England
    Now that is bad, never seen that one before!

    Some people have no concept of precision equipment, but would soon complain if their car engine only done 12mpg and needed a rebuild every 10k miles.
     
  10. spencer 427

    spencer 427 Member

    Messages:
    6,451
    uk colchester
    Location:
    uk colchester
    Unfortunately that's what some machinery movers are like..they dont care. Thankfully I haven't had anything damaged one one small part on my churchill lathe. But it can be a battle with some machinery in finding a suitable location to put strops.
     
  11. pressbrake1

    pressbrake1 Forum Supporter

    Messages:
    1,816
    essex england
    The answer is there.
    The problem is caused by idiots with hiabs , no clue or mechanical empathy.

    Proper insured machine movers are ok normally though Ive seen some nasty muck ups.
    Trouble is that machine movers ain’t getting outa bed for less than a grand
     
    mtt.tr likes this.
  12. pressbrake1

    pressbrake1 Forum Supporter

    Messages:
    1,816
    essex england
    To alot of so called machinists a lathe is just a tool like a hammer and treated as such
    Realistically if machines were well looked after and had reliable auto lube they would last a very very long time.
    Colchester lathes wear out but the old ones relied on a oil can on the ways and the later were built in the deluded hope that the operator cared enough to pull the lube plunger twice a shift..as if

    I went out to a lathe breakdown the other week.
    The operator had disconnected the headstock lube pump as he didn’t like the noise. Destroyed clutch and actuator forks. When I told him no remorse or emotion just blank stupid eyes.
    If it had been in my workshop he’d be going to a&e:mad:
     
  13. Keith 66 Member

    Messages:
    1,688
    Essex UK
    I have seen several lathes lifted with a crowbar stuck through the chuck & owned another that im pretty sure had the same treatment, a late Bantam 2000 thats bearings were noisy & shot. I sold it to a well known dealer at a loss & his hiab driver just picked it up again with a strop choked round the spindle behind the chuck. Next week it was on his website with POA under the description! I feel sorry for whoever bought it.
    Pallet trucks are another thing, I was offered a little used Elliot surface grinder & despite my offer to move it properly the college said "No we will move it outside", so pallet truck & a couple of caretakers, sharp corner & it went over on its front onto the concrete. Needless to say i told them i would not be picking it up after all & it was now their problem!
     
  14. Hopefuldave Intergalactic pot-mender

    Messages:
    1,173
    Location:
    The Shed of Danger, surrey, England
    These tales are why I rent a 4x4 and a plant trailer, own ratchet straps and rollers, borrow machine skates and buy beer...

    Dave H. (the other one)
     
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  15. Ali

    Ali Member

    Messages:
    501
    Location:
    Cheshire
    Took delivery of a new lathe last week, from a reputable supplier. Arrived at warehouse just as the firms own driver was slinging round the chuck. Stopped him and did it properly per manufacturers instructions using bars through purpose deigned lifting points. He said he always slings them by the chuck (25 years, man and boy, etc.) and I’m the first person who has ever complained. Then he said (and as I write this I’m still wondering if this wasn’t some sort of work-stress induced dream):

    ‘...well, the only damage it could possibly do would be the headstock bearings.’

    At that point I think he realised what he’d just said, and quietly got on with it.

    The place it was to be delivered to wanted it on the 1st floor but had an overhead gantry which could take the weight of this machine 20 times over.

    However.

    They refused to follow the manufacturers printed instructions (not Chinglish), and wanted to do it by the chuck. I said no. They had safety concerns about the bars. Fair enough.

    Went for lunch and when I came back there it was.

    I saw this recently which looks like the solution so I plan to make a couple, though still requires a good operator (which is half the battle anyway)

    A862EF28-8CAD-4380-8B1C-63F65C0F95CD.jpeg
     
    slim_boy_fat likes this.
  16. northwest Member

    Messages:
    828
    Location:
    Manchester UK
    For my bigger machines I use a guy who is not the cheapest but doesn't charge the earth either. He is calm and methodical and has plenty of experience. I have never had a drama. Well worth his fee. He advertises on the Homeworkshop site.
     
    eLuSiVeMiTe likes this.
  17. Spark plug

    Spark plug Member

    Messages:
    3,459
    Location:
    Durham, England
    So I’ve got the new bearings for my tailstock put them in:

    20E4F60F-E27A-42E5-898A-4EB1F2281592.jpeg

    Rebuilt the tailstock and measured the alignment to the saddle:

    BF67A903-9FDD-4B82-92D0-B68FE922D0A2.jpeg

    So before I started the parallelism of the tailstock quill to the saddle was out by approx 0.1mm over 300mm in both the horizontal and vertical plane. This was considerably more than the tolerance stated in the manual of +/- 0.025mm in each plane. After carrying out the work and re-measuring the tailstock is now back within tolerance with a run out of 0.02mm in both planes, which I am very happy with been as it’s a 45 year old machine.
     
  18. minimutly Member

    Messages:
    525
    Location:
    Pembrokeshire Wales
    Well done, nice to see.
    On this subject when I moved here, 25 years ago, my BIL wanted to shift my triumph by putting a bar in the chuck and using a jcb. I said no, the day got gradually worse...
     
  19. MCKDAVID Member

    liked your last phrase, and that's how I did mine, if you ever need a hand just shout...:drunk::drunk:
     
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  20. Geoffm Member

    For my rebadged Daishun Prince, I made a clamp like that although not as nice that clamps top and bottom of the lathe bed with a lifting eye. Worked really well and you could tweak the level by moving the tail stock. My Chipmaster has a hole through the bed for a through bolt or bar.
     
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