Compostion : 93% Argon 5% CO2 2% Oxygen advise

[Learning]

I am looking into the above welding mixture from Stargas,
am not keen on adding oxygen to the mix, I currently use BOC C5
and there is no oxygen in that as far as am aware its Argon and Carbon dioxide
and 2% oxygen, Argoshield light.

What will more oxygen contribute to the mix.
I can get a mix from SGS which does not have oxygen, though I have to travell a lot further
thus am looking at the Stargas product, all 50ltr cylinders at slightly differerent bar.

 

[Munkul]

O2 acts a bit like CO2, TechnicAl on here used to say 1% O2 = 2% CO2.
It also promotes better wetting at the weld toes.

Argoshield light has the same composition, so what is the problem?

I wouldn't be refusing it, it's great stuff to use, if you can't find a sweet setting on a welder with argoshield light then you probably aren't going to find one at all.

https://www.boconline.co.uk/en/images/shielding-gas-brochure_tcm410-80125.pdf

 

[Learning]

Thanks @Mankul
I am getting away from BOC, that’s why am looking into new gas suppliers and their mixes.
Am not having trouble with BOC C5, just wondered what difference to expect using their mix
which has a small amount of oxygen.

I can also get a mix from SGS which has no oxygen, in C5 C10 and C15 so it’s basically between the
non oxygen and 2%oxygen content, maybe that is the question I should have asked instead.

 

[Learning]

@Mankul , what mix do you recommend for out of position, 3mm overhead under trailor body,
and vertical up on 6mm, or is C5 good enough, I could get the new bottle in another mix as I have a dedicated C5 bottle.

 

[m_c]

From what I remember, the purpose of the oxygen is to help burn of impurities in the weld, but it's been a while since I done a mig course.

I certainly wouldn't be worried about the exact gas mix, unless I was doing something specific.

 

[8ob]

There will be a dilution of any gas the second it leaves the shroud, cant see how 2% 0 in the mix could possibly affect a weld in the grand scheme of things.

Bob

 

[Munkul]

There will be a dilution of any gas the second it leaves the shroud, cant see how 2% 0 in the mix could possibly affect a weld in the grand scheme of things.

Bob

Ah so that's like saying any old gas will do, then.
It doesn't work that way!

 

[Learning]

Gas mix does make a difference, when I welded for a living I did my own tests to see what worked
best in a given situation, I had three migs all the time with different mixes, and knew which one worked
best for a given situation..
That was a long time ago, and forgotten, just trying to get people's opinions to help me make a decent
choice.

Still on the subject, BOC state that their Argoshield Heavy can be used for spray transfer,
it is 78% Argon, 20% Carbon Dioxide, 2% Oxygen yet so many people tell me it cant, that a
higher Argon content is required, can anyone confirm if this is the case.

Thanks to all who posted

 

[Learning]

There will be a dilution of any gas the second it leaves the shroud, cant see how 2% 0 in the mix could possibly affect a weld in the grand scheme of things.

Bob

Maybe its to replace the oxygen already in the air that gets blown away when the trigger is pulled, but my welder does
not suffer that problem as no wire comes out until a certain amount of gas comes out first, so bey the time it arcs up the
has situation has stabilized.

 

[Dcal]

Its marvelous stuff and great unless you use it for dual shield welding.

Do tell,
I've been trying dual shield with Argoshield light and having no end of problems, worm holes and porosity.
I know I should be using heavy, but It's only for fun and I don't want to go to the expense of getting yet another flavour of gas.

Sorry for the thread hijack

 

[Munkul]

Still on the subject, BOC state that their Argoshield Heavy can be used for spray transfer,
it is 78% Argon, 20% Carbon Dioxide, 2% Oxygen yet so many people tell me it cant, that a
higher Argon content is required, can anyone confirm if this is the case.

You can spray with it if you can put enough voltage through it to get a visible arc length otherwise the arc will short-circuit into the puddle. On the order of 30v+ usually.

 

[backpurge]

We would never advise using Argoshield Heavy for welding with flux cored wire, our recommendations would be firstly to go with the wire manufacturers recommendation or stick with a straight Argon/CO2 mix such as Specshield 20%. The oxygen in Argoshield burns out alloying elements in the wire and can cause sub surface micro pores to form

 

[backpurge]

The oxygen in Argoshield improves droplet detachment, increases weldpool surface fluidity which reduces spatter, improves surface appearance and improves sidewall fusion as well as broadening the “sweet spot” with regard parameter selection

 

[Learning]

You can spray with it if you can put enough voltage through it to get a visible arc length otherwise the arc will short-circuit into the puddle. On the order of 30v+ usually.

Good to know, on single phase I think 28 volts welding is about my limit,
so would be better off with a C15 mix at least.
Sadly the closest Stargas depot only keep C5.

How does a C5 mix work for spray, its bound to begin spray transfer at the lowest
possible voltage that permits it to.

 

[Learning]

The oxygen in Argoshield improves droplet detachment, increases weldpool surface fluidity which reduces spatter, improves surface appearance and improves sidewall fusion as well as broadening the “sweet spot” with regard parameter selection

Well explained, thank you.

 

[Munkul]

Good to know, on single phase I think 28 volts welding is about my limit,
so would be better off with a C15 mix at least.
Sadly the closest Stargas depot only keep C5.

How does a C5 mix work for spray, its bound to begin spray transfer at the lowest
possible voltage that permits it to.

C5 allows spray transfer really easily, but the flip side is it limits your volts as the arc length is much longer for the same settings. So you get less energy into the puddle and therefore less penetration. You can make it work though.

 

[Dcal]

Our wire specifications specify heavy for the work we do and for pure CO2 its a different wire.

Many thanks @. and @backpurge for the information on flux core.
I have been intending to start a thread on my attempts to weld with fluxcore using less than perfect equipment, gas, consumables or technique. (The part rolls of wire I have could be up to 10 years old.)
If I may I'd like to tag you both when I do get a chance to play with it, hopefully over the holidays.
I think it would be useful exercise, even if it just shows it can't be done. (by me)

 

[backpurge]

Many thanks @. and @backpurge for the information on flux core.
I have been intending to start a thread on my attempts to weld with fluxcore using less than perfect equipment, gas, consumables or technique. (The part rolls of wire I have could be up to 10 years old.)
If I may I'd like to tag you both when I do get a chance to play with it, hopefully over the holidays.
I think it would be useful exercise, even if it just shows it can't be done. (by me)

No probs

 

[henry Kadzielski]

Just my two cents worth. When i did my mig welding certification, all that was used was argoshield light (or 52 as it was known). There (well here in Au) as we are upside down there is several suppliers of gas that do '52'. That 52 was used of welding 10mm samples in all positions. Here at the workshop I use that 52 for everything 3mm up to 25mm. The 25mm is done in multi run fillets. Max voltage i use is about 35v

it's great stuff to use, if you can't find a sweet setting on a welder with argoshield light then you probably aren't going to find one at all.

Couldn't aggree with @Munkul more with his above comment